Refrigerator Problem

[Andy Vidra]

Greetings! I have a 2007 2553 with a refrigerator problem. When we returned from our outing this past Friday, the refrigerator did not work on gas on the way home. Right now, the unit works perfectly when attached to 120 service. It even runs correctly in the gas only setting. However, as soon as I disconnect the electrical service, the gas mode shuts down. Here is what I suspect: when I hooked up the battery service to start the camping year, I foolishly reversed the battery cables. That meant that I had to replace the two 40A fuses in the main box and the fuse in the radio. Confronted with this problem, I pulled the number 2 fuse that runs the furnace and the refrigerator and it was OK. Not surprising given that the furnace worked while we were out last week in Northern Ohio. I have discovered that there are two fuses in the box attached to the back of the refrigerator but I can't figure out how to open the darn box even after removing to only screw that i can see. Does anybody have an idea what I need to do next (other than get help for my mental problem causing me to reverse battery cables).

[JohnB]

Originally Posted by Andy Vidra

Greetings! I have a 2007 2553 with a refrigerator problem. When we returned from our outing this past Friday, the refrigerator did not work on gas on the way home. Right now, the unit works perfectly when attached to 120 service. It even runs correctly in the gas only setting. However, as soon as I disconnect the electrical service, the gas mode shuts down. .

Hi Andy,

Don't beat yourself up on the battery cables; don't feel alone being the only one who "goofs" occasionally. I have, for sure, done my fair share of goofs. But I will say this; I'm sure you will not make that mistake again anytime soon... It's fresh in your memory now!

Let's do the easier thing first, the fridge's black control box cover; see these two pics. You already have the top center screw out. In this pic, it is still in place.




On the bottom front, left and right sides of the black cover are slot-looking tabs. Use a small to medium straight-blade screwdriver in the slot, gently pry the tab slightly outward, and tug a little to pull the cover. One side at a time.

On the PC board side of the cover, two hook tabs stick out on the bottom front, left, and right sides. Those hook tabs engage with corresponding tabs on the cover. When you tweak open the bottom of the cover, the PC board tabs let go.

Give that a try, and it will expose the PC board.

Now to your fridge issue. The PC board above is out of a 2004 Sunline. Your 2007 might be a slightly updated version; there is only one glass fuse in 2004.

But I do not think your fridge PC board itself has an issue. But for sure, if yours has two fuses, check them. In blue above, you state that the fridge at home runs perfectly OK on gas and 120 VAC electricity. OK, that says if the gas side runs while plugged into shore power, the fridge works on gas, and the gas controls are OK.

But, here is that, but again... you say as soon as you unplug the shore power, the fridge shuts down. OK, this points to a 12 VDC supply problem to the fridge. The fridge runs all controls off of 12 VDC. The 120 VAC only powers up the 120 VAC heating element. When you unplug shore power, yes, the PC board senses that you lost 120 VAC, and it switches to gas mode if you are in Auto on the fridge. If you are running on gas mode only and pull the shore power, nothing will switch as you are on gas, and the fridge should keep running.

Here is what I suspect is going on from what you have said. Something back at the power converter, and the main camper battery is having an issue. When you are on shore power, the power converter creates 12 VDC to power up the entire DC side of the camper. And if you pull the shore power, the converter will drop out, but here is the but again.... the battery should power the entire camper.

You never said if you lost the 12 VDC lights in the camper or the 12 VDC light in the fridge. If you have a problem between the converter and the battery, you will lose all 12 VDC when you pull the shoreline.

If you have a DC volt meter, check the battery's voltage. With no shore power, what is the battery voltage? Now plug the shore power in; what is the voltage at the battery? Here are some battery voltages to know if the power converter is connected to the battery.

A fully 100% charged battery at "rest" is 12.7 VDC. It will be less than 12.7 if the battery is less than 100%.

A battery connected to the power converter when it is on shore power will be 13.25 VDC or higher. 13.25 VDC = Float mode. 13.65 VDC is standard charge mode and 14.4 VDC is boost mode on your WFCO power converter.

Notice I state at "rest" on the battery only voltage. At rest means no power going in or out of the battery for about 8 hours. If you just charged it, it can have a fake surface charge of 12.9 and up, but you should see some change in the battery voltage between shore power plugged in and then unplugged. If you can measure the voltage, what is is?

Just try the lights in the camper with no shore power; if they work, the battery is connected to the DC fuse buss. If the lights are out and all DC in the camper is out, you may have an issue between the converter fuse buss and the battery.

NOTE: is the battery disconnect "on"?

Once you sort out the fridge shutting down at home issue, let's talk about the fridge not working on the way home. We needed more info on when the battery hook-up issue occurred and when the ride home and no fridge happened.

See if any of this helps and report back.

John

[Andy Vidra]

John,

Thanks for the info. I will follow your lead first thing tomorrow morning. By the way, the battery snafu happened at home when I was de-winterizing the camper. After I replaced the bad fuses everything seemed to work. The refrigerator was turned on the night before we left. Of course it was running on shore power then. My wife loaded the freezer with frozen goods on the morning that we left. Everything was properly frozen during our camping stay. It wasn't until we got back home that the refrigerator had a bunch of water in it. The trip home was only one hour long. I can't wait for tomorrow to check the battery and the rest. Thanks again for your advice.

[JohnB]

Originally Posted by Andy Vidra

Everything was properly frozen during our camping stay. It wasn't until we got back home that the refrigerator had a bunch of water in it. The trip home was only one hour long.

Hi Andy,

I hope the checkout turns up something. And you are welcome; glad to help as I can.

Do you recall a fault light being on when you made it home? The fault light is a gas flame fault, and the power must always be on since the fault happened to keep the light on. Turning the power off resets the fault.

When the fault light comes on, the controls detect the flame went out or did not light after three tries to reignite. Getting an actual flame fault can come from a few different things. But, if the fridge somehow lost power (lost 12 VDC), then the fridge would just stop and stay stopped until the power came back on. Then it would try and relight the burner.

The water in the freezer, if you are sure it was frozen at camp before you left, and had water in the bottom of the freezer after a 1 hr drive, the only thought I have is the fridge stopped working and stayed not working from the time you left camp. The freezer is insulated enough that when the camper stands still, and the fridge is off, the cold food would have kept the temperature low enough to not get above 32F. to allow water to form.

If the fridge lost power and stayed that way, traveling an hour, the coolant in the coil may have circulated some due to the towing/rocking motion and brought warm fluid into the freezer part of the coil, and started to add heat to the freezer section. I do not know if this can happen for a fact, but the heat exchanger can work in reverse if warm gas or fluid flows through it. The gas is normally always cold when the fridge is working.

For unknown reasons, yet anyway, the fridge's freezer mystery may be explained by the loss of 12-volt power.

This keeps pointing to the battery not sending power to the power converter fuse buss inside the camper. And if that is the issue, then there are things the way your 2007 is wired can cause that. One is the 30 amp auto-reset circuit breaker buried in the black plastic junction box behind the battery may have gone bad. Some do if they get moisture inside and corrosion starts. If you have never been into that junction box, and there are no screws out in the open that someone converted the box cover screw, let's talk about how to get in and hopefully not break the cover off.

Good hunting tomorrow for some clues.

John

[Andy Vidra]

John,

Good news and bad news. The good news is the problem is not with the refrigerator. The bad news is that I am a bigger moron than I thought and the electrical problem still exists. I never tried turning the lights on when the shore power was off. Nothing in the camper works right now without that power. I did pull the 30A fuse from the black box behind the battery and it was blown. I replaced it and hoped for the best. Nothing happened. I hooked my battery charger up to the battery. I get a voltage reading of 12.5 with an 82% charge reading. When I turned on the shore power the battery still reads 12.5. All of this was done with the battery disconnect switch in the on position. Before sending this update, I went out to make sure that I properly seated the replacement 30A fuse. Then the rainy snow came and thwarted my best intentions. If after doing that and the staus quo doesn't change any ideas as to what to do next?

[JohnB]

Hi Andy,

You did good! You made it into that junction box behind the battery. I can tell by your response the screws cooperated or a prior owner upgraded the evil original screws….

Now the the 30 amp replacement fuse inside that box, that is a good find, just not for the power inside issue. That replacement fuse is the truck charge fuse. The 7 wire cable has a truck battery wire in it to charge the camper battery when towing down the road. You needed that fuse changed for the future.

Now to the problem of getting power to the inside of the camper.

I’m not sure if you used a stand alone volt meter on the battery or you have a volt read out on your battery charger when you read the voltage. Which do you have?

You also did not mention if the camper was plugged into shore power when you did your voltage tests, , was it?

Not knowing the answers to those 2 questions, I’m going to go big picture as we can’t narrow it down without knowing those answers.

You did find the issue, we just have to narrow it down to 2 areas.

In that junction box behind the battery is a small silver rectangular device with 2 terminal posts on it. There would be a heavy red wire from the battery on one post, and another heavy red wire on the other post that goes inside the camper and connects to the power converter fuse board. That silver cube device is a 30 amp self resetting circuit breaker. It protects the battery and the wire in the event of a dead short in the wiring or the power converter going super high on the charge current.

That self reseting circuit breaker does go bad from time to time. When it dies, no power will pass to the power converter fuse board.

If you have a volt meter, just test for voltage on both posts in relation to battery negative post with the battery disconnect on. The camper does not have to be plugged in for this test. So unplug it to not confuse the results

The pin on the self reset breaker with the wire from the disconnect switch and battery positive should have 12 volts like the battery does. If it does not, then the disconnect switch is not working.

Next check voltage on the other pin on the self reset circuit breaker in relation to the battery negative post. That pin also should have the same 12 volts as the battery. If it does not, then the circuit breaker is bad and needs to be replaced.

You can take it out and go to the local Auto parts store for one. NAPA, Advance, O Reilly’s etc should all carry them. If

[JohnB]

Sorry did not finish and the response posted. Our internet is out and I’m on my phone…

If the voltage passes through the self resetting breaker then the problem is on the WFCO fuse board.

I suspect the self reseting breaker first. But one never knows on the WFCO’s as they age.

I normally post a pic of the inside of that battery area junction box, but not sure I can get to it on my phone.

Also, i suggest not to have shore power turned on and a battery charger on the battery with the disconnect switch being on. The 2 chargers can possibly affect each other in a bad way, If the disconnect is off, then no problem charging the battery while using shore power inside.

Hope this helps

John

[JohnB]

Our internet came back. Someone dug through the main fiber optic cable line feeding our internet provider's location.

These 2 pics may help. Your 2007 should look similar

[Andy Vidra]

Some progress, maybe. I pulled out my voltage meter and here are some numbers. The battery reading is 12.6 V. The disconnect switch side of the resetting breaker reads 12.6. The other side reads 10.7. Wat does this mean?

On a slightly different path, I see that you might be located in Ohio. I live in Chippewa Lake Village in Medina County. Where abouts do you live?

[JohnB]

Originally Posted by Andy Vidra

Some progress, maybe. I pulled out my voltage meter and here are some numbers. The battery reading is 12.6 V. The disconnect switch side of the resetting breaker reads 12.6. The other side reads 10.7. Wat does this mean?

On a slightly different path, I see that you might be located in Ohio. I live in Chippewa Lake Village in Medina County. Where abouts do you live?

I see you have done well in your testing. You can check it one more time, but if that self-resetting circuit breaker is dropping your 12.6 volts down to 10.7 volts, the breaker has internal issues. Replacing it is the fix for that specific issue.

Once past that issue and have it replaced, then use your voltmeter and test it again; it should have the same voltage coming out of it as the battery has.

Then, see if the lights inside work on battery only; if yes, the next step,

Plug in the shore power and do a voltage test on the battery. The power converter should boost the voltage from 12.6 up to 13.25 to 13.65 or above and start charging the battery. If that all works, life is good. If not, report back the battery's voltages with the power converter powered up on shore power and we can go from there.

Good luck!

John

PS, Yes, we are in Ohio, about 1' 50" ish south of your area. We are northwest of the city of Delaware in the middle of soybeans and corn fields in rural Ohio.

[Andy Vidra]

Houston, we have liftoff! Everything works including the gas on the refrigerator with the shore power off. The battery reads 13.7 volts with the power on. John, you are a genius with the patience of Job. Thank you very much with leading me through this mess. Now my 7-year-old granddaughters can relax and enjoy our upcoming trip to Mohican with them. One lives very close to us and the other is coming up from Chapel Hill, NC. I will have them join me in giving a salute in your direction for all of your help. Thanks again.

Andy

[JohnB]

Hi Andy,

First off, you are very welcome. We are here to help and glad too.

You did a great job sorting this out and learned a lot about your camper in the process. . I always say, one learns a lot more when things do not work right.

Yes, the kids and or grandkids are fun times with the camper. We camp a lot in the Ohio state park system. Seeing another Sunline in the campground is a rare event. It does happen, and I always have my Sunline finder on the lookout for them to go up and say Hi.

That said, when our son and his wife come to camp with it, they have a Sunline also; it is even more rare to see 2 Sunline next to each other in an Ohio SP. But there are a few other Ohio forum friends who camp with us too, so maybe not that rare.

Happy camping this year,

John