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Old 03-08-2018, 07:11 AM   #1
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Wanted - New Or Used Thermostat-OEM & help on system

I have a 1995 Sunline Solaris and the magnet fell out of my analog thermostat and fused to a circuit board which burned up the thermostat. I am looking for the exact fit which is a Dometic Duo-Therm Analog Thermostat # 3105058. I am attaching some pictures and hope to find one, if I have to search nationwide from vendors or rv salvage yards. My only other option is to upgrade but I would rather locate one. If anyone can help me to find one , it would be greatly appreciated. I am attaching some pics of the one I have.

Thank you
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Old 03-08-2018, 02:59 PM   #2
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H'mm, you have a learning one there, at least for me.

Your pics are really good in this case. From the trail I can find is this.

Your Thermostat part number comes up as bi-metal one and not an analog one. It may not be the furnace with the issues as much as the AC unit but really do not know. In a 1995 Sunline, that is odd too as the AC unit should have 12 volt control too. Worst case give us the model number of the furnace and the AC control box up in the ceiling and we can back into why a bi-metal one and not an analog one.

I found this trail. If you order from these folks suggest you call can verify they are real.

This thread may help. Take note of Chris Bryant's 2 posts on their. I know of him and he is a trusted source and has his own RV shop. RV.Net Open Roads Forum: Tech Issues: Thermostat replacement This is Chris's site Bryant R.V. Services

From I can can tell from several places you "do not" want part number Durotherm 3106995 as that is an analog T stat and not a bi-metal one. Seems many folks have tried to get a 3105058 and was given a 3106995 and that did not work right. Do not know exactly why.

According to this trail, (you must confirm it) Duro Therm 3105058.014 is replaced with Duro Therm 331347.000. I think the .014 came along the way in revisions.

Here are pics






They came from this site. Never bought from them, have no idea if they are credible. Find Duo-Therm by DOMETIC Thermostat 3313477.000/3105058.014 motorcycle in Portland, Oregon, US, for US $59.99

This site shows the new replacement but I cannot find it on their site. May have to call. Have not bought from them either, suggest you call and confrim


https://hvacpartstore.myshopify.com/

Hope this helps and let us know how you make out.

John
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Old 03-11-2018, 08:05 AM   #3
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Do you know if any bi-metal White -Rodgers or Atwood thermostats will work , aside of Dometic as a compatible substitute for P/N 3313107.089 ? I'm having cost and availability issues and rather stick to a bi-metal solution as opposed to a complete upgrade. Also can anyone help me figure out what wires will operate the furnace for heat in the meantime ?
Thanks- Looking forward to the point where heat is not needed.
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Old 03-11-2018, 07:34 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyJ55 View Post
Do you know if any bi-metal White -Rodgers or Atwood thermostats will work , aside of Dometic as a compatible substitute for P/N 3313107.089 ? I'm having cost and availability issues and rather stick to a bi-metal solution as opposed to a complete upgrade. Also can anyone help me figure out what wires will operate the furnace for heat in the meantime ?
Thanks- Looking forward to the point where heat is not needed.
That 3313107.089 you found, oh my is that darn thing out of this world in cost.

https://hvacpartstore.myshopify.com/...stat-heat-cool

Can you supply us with the model number of the furnace and the roof AC unit control box? (the electrical box above the filter screen inside the camper)

The control box would have a pic like this with a wiring diagram on it. This is out of mine.

Take a pic of that sticker we we can read the numbers

The furnace will have a sticker on the motor outside the camper behind the grill. Should look something like this. Take a pic we can read the numbers on.


I want to look up the wiring diagrams of them to know for sure exactly what you have so I can help better.


Also, do you have pics of the wires colors on the terminals of your existing T stat? If I can read the letters of the connection screws and what wire color is on what screw, I may be able to back into what you have and how to help better.

Something is not adding up on why your's has to be a bi-metal T stat in the first place. It may work well, just not understanding yet the why. The standard Hydroflame furnace, if the furnace run signal wire is connected to - 12 volt DC (ground) the furnace will run. The Dometic Brisk air AC units have a fan and the cool input and they too will run if signal wire is connected to ground. But you might have something different so I need to see what you have first.

I replaced my T stat with a digital Hunter T state from Walmart for $20. It needs 2, AA batteries to run it but it is a relay type T stat and regulates temps within +/- 1 degree. The old analog that came with the camper was like +/- 5 degrees. The only thing I never did was add a hi/lo fan switch for the AC. I just use it on hi.

Spending over $200 on a T stat is an absolute last resort. And the sad part, the regulation is still really bad.

Hope this helps

John
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Old 03-12-2018, 12:13 PM   #5
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Hi John;
Thanks for the feedback. I have taken 3 pictures which I will attach to this post. For a while I was able to connect just the red and white wires on the left side of the picture of wires. The furnace ran fine for a while but now the blower just blows cold air and the ignition system doesn't seem to work as before. I do have a Dinosaur Electronics time delay relay which worked fine before the magnet dropped on the board and fused itself to the board - this being the original Dometic 3105058 thermostat. I'm not sure what is going on and will attempt to run all tests that you deem necessary in order to fix this issue. Thanks for your help.
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Old 03-12-2018, 08:04 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyJ55 View Post
Hi John;
Thanks for the feedback. I have taken 3 pictures which I will attach to this post. For a while I was able to connect just the red and white wires on the left side of the picture of wires. The furnace ran fine for a while but now the blower just blows cold air and the ignition system doesn't seem to work as before.

I do have a Dinosaur Electronics time delay relay which worked fine before the magnet dropped on the board and fused itself to the board - this being the original Dometic 3105058 thermostat. I'm not sure what is going on and will attempt to run all tests that you deem necessary in order to fix this issue. Thanks for your help.
Hi Randy,

Can you get me the model number of the furnace and the AC unit control box? Your pics cut off some info I needed.

On the AC unit, your pic cut off the words on the left and it looks like there may be 24 volts involved which may be part of this bi metal T stat need. Please retake that pic so I can see the entire sticker and a few close up if needed. I need to see all of it. A relay type T stat may be able to be used with that even if it is 24 volt.

On the furnace, OK you already knew to hot wire the furnace and it would run, but now you have a new problem.

The cold air blowing and the ignition not working is a separate problem. The T stat does not affect this. The T stat just gives a run signal permissive to create heat. The furnace control board then starts doing the rest. But some of the older furnaces had a relay in them that did a lot of the control. Again why I need the model number on the furnace.

You "might" have a battery voltage problem or a converter voltage problem if you are plugged into shore power. The fan has to run fast enough to create enough wind to trip a sail switch safety to allow the burner to ignite. Do you have a voltmeter and can you check the voltage at the furnace while the blower is running? Fan running and no burner is classic to rule out the sail switch has to be made first. After that is confirmed then we dig deeper.

The Dinosaur board, what model it that and I'm assuming you are using it on the furnace as a control board? But you said a time delay relay and that does not sound like the ignition board on the furnace or how a magnet could drop on it inside the furnace... Tell me more about what board you have and how you are using it.

Just need some more info to help better.

Thanks

John
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Old 03-12-2018, 08:11 PM   #7
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This pic looks like you have 2 sets of wires


A set on the left that looks like maybe the red and white for the furnace you were talking about, yes/no?

And then a 4 wire set from the brown cable, this must be from the AC unit? yes/no?

The newer systems are all one cable, not split up like this, but what you have may just be how they did it back then. Especially if the AC unit is creating it's own voltage to run the T stat system.

Do you know what wire colors were on what terminal on the old T stat? Since we have no wire numbers, colors are the wire codes to talk to.

And if you can, try a more clear pic of this and all the words on the bottom

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Old 03-12-2018, 08:18 PM   #8
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Moved post from "Wanted Ad" forum to "Repairs and Maintenance" for better viewing and help.
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Old 03-13-2018, 06:01 PM   #9
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Hello John;
You may have a good point with the blower motor. The motor now squeals and I'm not sure where to oil the motor. I believe that this issue may be the cause of the sail switch not tripping as you mentioned. I am going to attach some pictures as you've requested along with the model numbers of the A/C Unit and the furnace. I hope this helps. Iwill aslo provide a picture of the thermostat wire terminals . The Model number of the Hydroflame furnace is 8531-111. The model number of the A/C unit is 57915-621.

Thank you
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Old 03-13-2018, 09:49 PM   #10
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Hi Randy,

I think we are gaining, on the furnace and maybe the AC unit. Let's start with the furnace.

You show you have the Hydroflame 8531-III. This decoded down is an 85 series furnace, 30,000 BTU - generation III.

I do not know how electrically friendly you are on 12 volt DC circuits. If any of this is too much for you, stop. Only do any of this if you feel this is within your means.

This link will take to the 2003 tech manual for all of the Hydroflame furnaces. http://bryantrv.com/docs2/docs/hflamefurn04.pdf

To your wiring diagram. The images are too blurry to see but what I can see is that they gave you a variety of diagrams, several are not for your furnace. You have to find the right one amongst what they gave you.

This diagram in the upper right, is an AC control voltage furnace. I can see the 120vac transformer and the motor starting capacitor. I believe this is "not" what you have. So disregard it. I have not yet seen Sunline install a 120 VAC furnace unless someone else did.


This one is a lot closer, but I cannot read it all but this could be it.


In the link above I gave you on the tech manual, on PDF page 10 in the lower right corner is the wiring diagram for the 85 series - III with local flame sense feedback. It may be this one.

OR on the top of page 11, is the 85 series - III with remote flame sense feedback. It could be this one. I can't tell from what we can see on your pics.

The only difference between those 2 is the flame sensing circuit. The local sense uses the actual electrode to send a millivolt signal back to the ignition board to tell the flame is on, the remote sense one uses an actual probe to send a millivolt signal back to the ignition board. Right now the flame sense is not your issue so it may not even matter.

I do not know of a way to oil the motor bearings. I do not think they even have an oil port like some motors do. The blower motor is pretty buried in the heart of the furnace as there is 2 blower blades on the one motor. One for the inside blower fan to push the heat inside the camper, the other blade to blow the gas heat through the combustion chamber and back outside.

See page 16 of the PDF for a sequence of operation. And look at the wiring diagram on page 10 or 11 as mentioned above.

What we do know, on your furnace there is a relay that sort of runs the show. The T stat when it calls for heat energizes the relay and it's contacts close to start the motor. It also has a contact that when energized sends 12 volts to the sail switch. You jumping the wires in the camper simulates the T stat.

When the sail switch closes it sends 12 volts through a normally closed thermal disk switch which is a safety device as it opens up when the combustion chamber gets too hot and shuts down the ignition board. If the furnace is cool enough, the 12 volts is sent to the ignition board.

The ignition board then powers up the gas valve (you can hear a clunk of the valve opening) and it powers up the high voltage ignitor. (if you listen outside real close you should hear it sparking/clicking. The burner ignites and the flame sense feedback tells the ignition board the flame is on and everything keep burning until either the over temp switch opens or the T stat is satisfied.

Let's start with the simple things. Once the blower starts running, the sail should swing and close the switch. In about 15 to maybe 20 seconds of the sail switch closed, the gas valve will open and you hear a clunk. Followed by the igniter sparking.

From the point the igniter is sparking, there is about 6 seconds where the flame sense should tell the board flame is on. If no flame feedback it shuts down the gas and the ignition. I believe the older boards still did 3 tries to light and then goes into lock out. Meaning that after it did not fire off the 1st time, it will pause, allow the blower to run to purge the chamber, and then try again for 6 seconds. After the 3rd try of not flame feedback, it locks out on a flame fault safety until it is reset.

The blower on the older ones keeps running and you have to turn the T stat off, then back on to reset the system. In your case, untwist the wires wait a few seconds and jump them back together again.

Try and listen for the gas valve clunk and the sparking. Right now we do not know if the sail switch is being made, or the gas valve is opening or the igniter is firing. If you do not hear any gas valve clunk or sparking then the sail switch may have never made. If you hear sparking, then the sail switch made just the gas valve never opened. If you hear the gas valve clunk but no sparking, then the sail switch is working and the control board is partly working, but the ignitor may not be. OR there is a problem with the electrodes inside the combustion chamber.

If it comes that you hear no clunk or sparking at all, then it may be the control board is dead, or the sail switch never closed or maybe low voltage etc. You will have to sort that out. Here it gets more involved.

Start by checking the incoming voltage to the furnace. Voltage should be between 10.5 and 13.5 VDC at the furnace when the blower is running. There should be an on/off switch/circuit breaker at the furnace. Check the power between the switch and DC negative/ground for the proper voltage. Remember what the reading is with the blower running.

If that is good then by the wiring diagram, the white wire going into the ignition control board is the power feed from the sail switch/over temp switch. You will need to use a voltmeter on 12 VDC to see if power is ever reaching the PC board. Find the white wire and measure that to 12 volt DC negative. It should have power with the blower running. If no power the sail switch is not closed or the high temp switch has a problem.

Be careful. The above implies you know how to handle yourself around electricity. The igniter wire is high voltage like a spark plug on an engine. It will bite. If any of this you have not done like this before, stop. You can test all the clicks and clunks with the gas turned off. Right now you are trying to see if the gas valve ever clunked and the spark is ever sparking.

Hope this helps and let us know how you make out.

John
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Old 03-13-2018, 10:32 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandyJ55 View Post
The model number of the A/C unit is 57915-621.
Randy,

This diagram seems to indicate they are using a 24 volt AC control circuit. This is common in home heating and cooling systems and it seems maybe in the older Dometic systems. The newer ones all use 12 VDC.


I finally found an install cut sheet on your older 579 series roof AC unit. 57915-621.

I had the install and user manual instructions on my hard drive from long ago. Since someone else may need this in the future, I uploaded it to the Sunline Files section. The files section, see on top of the forum for the words "FILES" click it when logged in.


Then go to "Heating and Cooling" the cut sheet is in there. Here is a link that should take you directly to the download
Sunline Coach Owner's Club - Sunline Owner's Files - Dometic 579 AC unit install instructions for older

Page 11 has the bi metal T stat and all the wire call outs.

But... the problem I am having is knowing for sure what the Dometic part number of your control box is. The roof AC unit is the 57915-621. That is the compressor and all that is up on the roof.

Inside the camper somewhere on the galvanized control box up in the ceiling that had this wiring diagram


There should be a Dometic part number on one of the stickers for the control box. The control box is a separate part from the roof unit. The directions I linked about says that unit could use a Part No. 3104998 Relay Kit. I need you to confirm that is the correct part number or it is another one.

That relay kit does not 100% match the wiring diagram in your camper but is pretty darn close except for where it says 24 VAC. See if you can hunt down the control box part number. Odds are high it is a 7 digit number and starts with a 3. Or confirm it is Part No. 3104998.

See what you can find and report back. Once past finding the part number to go with your wiring diagram we should be able to figure out the T Stat setup and how to wire in a standard $20 - $30 digital relay driver T stat to run both the furnace and AC unit if you cannot locate a bi metal T stat. Or figure out another path.

Thanks

John
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