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Old 07-12-2007, 12:04 PM   #1
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SUN #328
bugbite
Whoa Nelly! Hensley just called > go figure!

Dear Sunline family (Will I or won't I be in the family? hope so!)

I sent off for Hensley Arrow literature (over my head but not the other bipeds) about 1 1/2 weeks ago.

Low and behold who called me to see if we had received the literature???
(Naturally they thought Pat was a man... sigh... it happens all the time... asked for Pat, said I am Pat)

Now not out of the goodness of their hearts altogether they do cost 3 times the money of a Reese, Drawtite, or Equal-i-zer brands.

But here's what I learned (I hope, tried to understand and write stuff down).

I got handed over immediately from the customer service rep to a Rick person when I asked...

First hit him on price... do they EVER have sales on these puppies?
Yes, at the end of the year maybe knock off 500ish. Maybe more knock off if one wants to buy a "reconditioned" hitch.

OK one can negotiate to get shipping knocked off which would make it 2995. The 12 inch extension kit (electric cable mates on both ends & 2 chains) runs 48.90 ontop of the hitch price. Chain pair alone is 9.95.

We were discussing ball size so HE could figure tongue wt. on a 1950. I didn't have the Sunline stuff in front of me... is the 1950 a 2" or 2 5/16" ball? I guessed 2 5/16ths? Anyway...

For the bars supplied it's a difference of 750 lb. vs. 1000 lbs types. Both the same price.

OK I thot I would pass that along. Always good to deal w/ the factory if possible vs. going thru a dealership. Wait until he gets grilled by the other here. I already asked him stuff the average bear doesn't think to ask... just wait! He ain't seen nuttin' yet! Told him to study up before he called back.

Say something I didn't ask but we shouldn't have to pay tax right --Theoretically of course... they are in Michigan.

Oh they are busy this time of year (still) as one can imagine. Running about 2 wks to get to the customer's home. But one can as part of the art of the deal get the name bumped up as it were.

So still studying the relative merits of all hitches. I do think a Hensley altho about 70 lbs. lighter will help us out on weight distribution more. We need as much wt. going back on the trailer as possible.

Boyo boy have I had to come up to a limping speed so far. Started w/ zip. Thanks to you kind and HELPFULpeople here it has helped speed my learning curve.


Salute to the friendliest and best of forums or groups of the many I am on!

Anything else I need to ask him???

BB (still lost in a fog abeit lighter one)
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Old 07-12-2007, 02:16 PM   #2
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Hi Pat,

I’m sure you’ve already have researched and viewed all of this information already but just incase you haven’t.

Hensley Web Site Home Page

How it Works You-Tube Video, pretty cool explanation using Legos.

Hensley Arrow Installation & Operation Manual

Open Roads Forum Topic on the Hensley Arrow, it’s only 53 pages long, so I expect you to read all of it, if you haven’t already . Seriously, the 1st page of the topic has a good diagram of what’s shown in the You-Tube video.

Now to try and answer some of your questions.

One thing to ask Hensley, based on your tow vehicle and the T-1950, ask what type of hitch bar they would recommend. They provide a straight, 1” drop / rise, 2” drop /rise, etc.

You’ll need 3 pieces of information for Hensley for them to determine this (see page 3 of the Hensley Manual) including:
1. Tow Vehicle’s Receiver Height – measure (with tow vehicle running) from ground to top inside of receiver.
2. Trailer’s Coupler Type – T-1950 has a type B (as/ pg 3 of Hensley Manual)
3. Trailer’s Hitch Ball height – Sunline spec’s a T-1950 at 17.5” – use this value.

Here’s some clearance information on our Hensley set up that may help you determine what your clearance might be with a Hensley.

Information and Clearance on our T-280SR.

T-280SR Trailer’s Hitch Ball height is 23.75” (6.25” higher than the T-1950)
We’re using a 2” drop bar to have the trailer level when hooked up and we have 1200 lb WD bars.

From top of the trailer’s tongue frame, the assembly jacks / WD bars hang down ~9.5”


Measured from the ground, the ground clearance is ~15”



As the picture shows, I set the assembly jacks on the 2nd (middle) mark.
But for me, that’s not really the low point. The low point is actually where the WD bars attach to the Hensley Hitch Assembly (i.e., under that big orange thingy).


Here I have ~12.5” of clearance measured from the ground (sorry, the picture isn’t that great).



Now, how does that affect you and what could you expect your clearance to be with a T-1950 and your tow vehicle?

First, its based on Hensley will set you up with a hitch bar that your T-1950 will be level when hooked up to your tow vehicle.

With our T-280SR hooked up and level, its Hitch Ball height is 23.75”.
When your T-1950 is hooked up and level your Hitch Ball height will be 17.5”.
That’s a difference of 6.25”, with your T-1950 sitting lower.

Therefore, subtract 6.25” from my measurements and you have a rough estimate of what your clearance might be with a Hensley Arrow.

That is I would guess your clearance might be:
~6” of clearance between ground and bottom of WD bars at point where they connect to the Hensley Hitch assembly.
~9” of clearance between ground and bottom of WD bars / jack assembly.

That’s just my guess.


For your question on what size of weight distribution bars.

The T-1950 hitch/tongue weight is spec’d by Sunline at 420#, so I would think that the 750# weight distribution bars would be sufficient. But JohnB could provide information on this. Based on some of John’s posts and the impact turning has on sifting weight from one bar to the other, you may want to consider the 1000# bars, if they’re the same price.

A good question for JohnB - is it bad to go larger on WD bars? That is, if 750# are ok for you, would it hurt to go to 1000# bars?

Also, the Hensley Arrow can be installed yourself. The first time you do it, plan to take 4 – 6 hours installing it. Their instructions are good, just take your time. I've installed ours probably about 4 - 5 times now. Still takes me 2 - 3 hours to do it on our trailer's tongue with everything already drilled out and positioned.

FYI, when I’ve called Hensley with technical questions, I’ve always talked with Jarrod Robbins, he really knows his stuff.

So when do you pick up pamwinn’s T-1950 she has for sale?

Hutch
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Old 07-12-2007, 02:36 PM   #3
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SUN #328
bugbite
Quote:
Originally Posted by PTHutch
Hi Pat,

<<Hi>>

I’m sure you’ve already have researched and viewed all of this information already but just in case you haven’t.

<<Not>>

Hensley Web Site Home Page

How it Works You-Tube Video, pretty cool explanation using Legos.

Hensley Arrow Installation & Operation Manual

Open Roads Forum Topic on the Hensley Arrow, it’s only 53 pages long, so I expect you to read all of it, if you haven’t already . Seriously, the 1st page of the topic has a good diagram of what’s shown in the You-Tube video.

>>HA Ha ha! I started reading part of it on Trailer Life ... man did they ever get emotional fast! A real slugfest!

Thank you for the above links. Hensley has money to burn they sent us a video too. Mind you neither of us have seen it yet. Wouldn't do me much good. Way over my head.<<Now>> Thank you bro Hutch! You are a goodun!<<

The T-1950 hitch/tongue weight is spec’d by Sunline at 420#, so I would think that the 750# weight distribution bars would be sufficient. But JohnB could provide information on this. Based on some of John’s posts and the impact turning has on sifting weight from one bar to the other, you may want to consider the 1000# bars, if they’re the same price.

<<Yeah>>

A good question for JohnB - is it bad to go larger on WD bars? That is, if 750# are ok for you, would it hurt to go to 1000# bars?

Also, the Hensley Arrow can be installed yourself. The first time you do it, plan to take 4 – 6 hours installing it. Their instructions are good, just take your time. I've installed ours probably about 4 - 5 times now. Still takes me 2 - 3 hours to do it on our trailer's tongue with everything already drilled out and positioned.

>>I'll make Rick hand off to Jarrod.

On Pam's......................

YOU ARE CRUEL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!! <<
BB
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Old 07-12-2007, 02:57 PM   #4
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If you do get a Hensley and you have any questions about installing it, just ask.

Note I used Nuts & Bolts to install the frame bracket to the tongue instead of the self tapping shear bolts provided. I'm sure Hensley wouldn't approve because of the change in shearing forces, but it made my life so much easier.
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Old 07-12-2007, 04:06 PM   #5
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I have been very happy with our Equal-i-zer. does the same thing, but t a fraction of the price. I know folks that have been running equilizer for years. I looked at the Hensly, also, but I couldn't justify the 2300 bucks!
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Old 07-12-2007, 05:07 PM   #6
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SUN #328
bugbite
Big difference in $$$ vs $$$$

Quote:
Originally Posted by tinybluetj
I have been very happy with our Equal-i-zer. does the same thing, but t a fraction of the price. I know folks that have been running equilizer for years. I looked at the Hensly, also, but I couldn't justify the 2300 bucks!
Yep. Wop'ing amount. Just thot I would bring the conversation up to yall who know these puppies and TTs. This will be our first and last.

Also looking into the Reese. I sent off for their info. too, haven't gotten it yet. Haven't hit the Equal-i-zer site yet. Headed that way.

We are talking 2/3 more on price diff. That is substantial.
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Old 07-13-2007, 10:14 AM   #7
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SUN #328
bugbite
I swear I didn't join them... Hensley has a Yahoo Group...

Got this in my bugbite Yahoo mail.

But then I get OTD/CRS bumps on my head daily... ever go down a hallway on a mission... get to the end and forget for the life of you what you are after???

----------

"...

* To learn more about the hensleyarrowrvhitchclub group, please visit
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hensleyarrowrvhitchclub

* To post a message to this group, send email to
hensleyarrowrvhitchclub@yahoogroups.com

* To contact the moderator of this group, send email to
hensleyarrowrvhitchclub-owner@yahoogroups.com

Thank you for choosing Yahoo! Groups as your email group service.

..."
----------

"...

To see and modify all of your groups, go to
http://groups.yahoo.com/mygroups

..."
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Old 07-22-2007, 01:32 AM   #8
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SUN #328
bugbite
Latest hitch drama

Dear Sunline Family I wish I was in...

I forgot I told the Hensley Arrow guy to call back when my resident engineer was back. Mostly for my amusement and to hear a salesman get his run for the money. Sorry salesmen out there I have been to far too many stereotypical carlots throughout the years. The latest of course is kicking some tires at our local Travel Trailor lots with the out for a sale at any cost salesmen claiming our Tundra could bull anything in the lot.

We just can't justify until we retire getting a diesel. We still use the Tundra round town occasionally for other uses. The Tundra is a real cherry still smelling new at 30K. Barely broken in for a Tundra that will go probably farther than any Gasser thus far made reliably on a V-8 4.7 range. WOT power not in dispute. But again the lousy tow vehicle that it is.

OK the fateful call.........

RING, Ring, ring. Saturday Morning 10:30 AM.

Just caught bits and pieces... told the guy NOT to bother calling back unless he had all his info in a row. Did that to protect his ego.

Well 45 minutes later, painful to the salesman I am sure... I caught this one... my engy asking what kind of grease. Didn't hear the answer but any good automotive grease will do for the fittings.

Engy came back with some long string of particular grease. No doubt blew the other guy out. Asked if my engy was a truck driver since he knew so much about hitches.

I previous warned the guy he would be talking to one of the most detail oriented engies ever (down Hutch's alley).

----

Anyway... the redux is this... Joe told the guy even tho. the guy claimed the Hensley Hitch would allow us to pull a much heavier than our Tundra could pull that it's a matter of tongue wt. and handling. Far too many people get a much too heavy trailer than their tow vehicle can pull. There is a definite break point for 1/2 Tons (gassers), 3/4 Diesels, and 1 Ton Diesels.

Out of all the 1/2 Ton gassers the Tundra the very worst on a tow. Will blow the rest of them as a cruiser anyday but one crummy tow-er.

We must go no more than 5,500 GVWR given out payload of just us in a gas filled, us, Snug Top, rubbermat, tubes. Unfortunately we didn't get the axle measurements that Hutch and JohnB recommended on our maiden CAT weigh in. We will next time. We weigh out as 5,540. Reallly limits what we can pull even further for the atypical load we have wetly-dry.

Still in pursuit, at least I am, of a Travel Trailer that will work w/ our Tundra. I am broken hearted it may not be a Sunline, my first choice. I am fully prepared to go look and buy Pam's 1950 which would be the max we should pull for safety match. I got shot down because an island bed seemed to be a requirement all the sudden.

OH Joe came home from PA with the rapidly disappearing Sunline brochures. Made me lust even more after a Sunline. It's one thing to view them on line but even better a hardcopy.

Wishing it may not make it so...

The resident engineer still tired from his very successful trip not so inclined.


Only can think of our condo rental wk. of Sept. 1st down to Ft. Walton Beach.

I realllly appreciate at our age just how fast the summers fly. I hate it no 3 day weekend trips for us this year. Those of us aging wishing for the day we can retire can appreciate more and more just how short life is.

So that's where we stand. Me waiting for the Travel Trailer hunt to strike my engineer with far more patience than me. Me checking the few alternatives waiting for the yeah we can get serious here thumbs up.

Thot yall get a kick out of the salesman workout. I just love to hear vicariously my man do his thing. Hutch and JohnB would be very proud of him!

Lesson for all contemplating any purchase of another (or their first) travel trailer...

A man needs to know his limitations. Don't overload. Do your math John B and Hutch have taught us. Just because we can pull most trailers of a lot doesn't mean we should.

We (all of us) will suffer on those long steep grades and mountains. We will suffer for the emergency stops even tho. we have great distributing hitches. Talk about too a transmission killa'

Getting a rig up to speed achievable for probably most of us... it's the
stopping power that matters. No sense killing ourselves, our families, and other families just because we want some trailer just for its amenities inside.

We have all witnessed sig. lines and pictures of rigs elsewhere... obviously someone who has not done the math. It is obvious these people have ignored tongue wt. and wheel base ratio. The ones pulling the monsters of 34 ft. obviously should pull with a diesel 1 Ton dually. Probably a Dodge Cummins.

There is an example of a guy pulling a 34ftr. on a forum we all know using a F-150 (HD he claims) gasser. Man needs a dually 1 Ton!

Sounds like our Hutch knows he is very close to 1 Ton diesel country. He knows his limitations and probably realizes that the more one goes camping the more they bring in goodies. Time to do an inventory... do I REALLY need x nice camping goody???

Pat
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Old 07-22-2007, 10:08 AM   #9
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The what hitch to buy question almost always degenerates into a my (insert hitch maker)-is-better-than-your (insert hitch maker) multiple-page thread. It's the travel trailer version of Chevy vs. Ford threads. Interesting perhaps, but not helpful in making an informed decision on what to buy. Sometimes too much information is just as bad as not enough. (I'm guilty of this myself: I think everyone should tow with a diesel.)

I don't claim to be an expert, but I've towed enough to learn that a well set up hitch from any reputable manufacturer towing a trailer within the capacities of an appropriate tow vehicle will do a good job. If you have a preference for a particular hitch, then great--buy it. But if you're researching what hitch to buy, don't rely too much on forum threads (I'm thinking of RV.net here, not this one) where responses may simply echo responders' private preferences--which aren't necessarily objective or similar to yours. Hensley certainly has a lot of serious fans, and probably for good reasons. However, when you yourself look at hitch cost, maintenance, complexity, ease of use, distance you tow, how often you tow, and other variables you might come to a different conclusion.
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Old 07-22-2007, 04:28 PM   #10
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SUN #328
bugbite
I certainly didn't mean to infer...

Hey, this was just a fun post.


I was completely surprised Hensley even called me when all I did was fill out a request for information along with some other hitchmakers. Thought it was unusual and thought for sure they would forget to call back.

I have no idea if we are going to spring for a Hensley or not. It's one heck of a lot of money. Would be more apt to do so if we were camping full time.

Just a mental exercise at the moment. I have also researched Reese Duo Cam and Equal-i-zer too. Both look just fine for our purposes.

Not meant at all to be mine in better than yours etc.

Shoot fire, we don't even have a travel trailer yet!

I apologize if it was taken that way.

Didn't mean the other thread to be Tundra is better than Ford, Ford better than GM, Dodge better than GM or Ford and anyother combination of trucks better than others at all either. I have pointed out that each has their brand loyalty and strengths. No one the answer be all and end all for anyone.

I have said over and over again of the four Tundra is definitely the weakest of all to tow. Just makes a very nice cruising truck. What makes it so smooth, powerful, and quiet makes it a very unsuitable tow vehicle.

Here we go again, me having to explain myself and apologize!

I shall crawl into a hole and hide from the world now.
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Old 07-23-2007, 05:12 AM   #11
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No apologies necessary. Remember, I said "I'm thinking of RV.net," not this forum. It's no reflection on you; I was just taking advantage of the thread to comment that the topic of hitch preference, like Chevy vs. Ford or Prodigy vs. Primus, tends for some reason to elicit strong responses from folks apparently deeply committed to a particular brand of product (search the RV.net archives to confirm this). It makes for interesting reading but these threads don't offer much actual information. I can understand the attachment to a particular brand of truck or car--vehicles are a central part of our lives and RVing hobby, but hitches?

The great thing about this forum in particular is that you can throw out an idea knowing someone thoughtful will respond and give you something to think about.
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Old 07-23-2007, 05:26 AM   #12
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I have towed al kinds of dtuff over thr years. Tractors, Bobcats and all sorts of equipment. I have always used what is on the back of the truck. I am not sure why you would need such a contraption it looks like a lot of dtuff to go wrong. I think common sense is the best hitch you can use.
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