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Old 06-14-2011, 04:06 PM   #21
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John
Sorry it took me so long to get this information. I got the Sequoia weighed and this is it. I had a full tank of gas but I was the only passenger and I didn't have any camping equipment.
steer axle 2900 lbs.
drive axle 2640 lbs.
Gross weight 5540 lbs.
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Old 06-16-2011, 09:14 PM   #22
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Wayne, I see your post but a bit busy right now as son getting married this Saturday and the family is all here. I will respond shortly after the weekend if someone else does not help add this up for you. Be back soon.

John
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Old 06-17-2011, 05:41 AM   #23
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Thanks for the reply. Congratulations to your son, and I hope everything goes well this weekend.
Wayne
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Old 06-17-2011, 06:59 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry stone View Post
Why not think about getting a real truck? The cost to fix the broken SUV will be the same as buying a real truck.
Hey, Wayne, we towed a pop-up with a '05 Tundra 4X4 because we do a lot of off-road boondocking. When we fell into a deal on a Sunline, my wife was concerned that that truck would be at its limits for pulling and stopping a 3-ton trailer.
Rest of story: Dealer fell all over himself to get his hands on my '05 and put me in a '10 Tundra with 4-wheel disc brakes and a 11,000+lbs. of towing capacity. Zero percent financing iced the deal. Check with your Toyota store and see what kind of deals they have. If you can wait until August, you'll get a great deal on trade for an '11.

Good luck,
Teach
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Old 06-22-2011, 09:35 PM   #25
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Hi Wayne


I have updated the info. Now armed with this here is how this stacks up.

I filled in what you gave us in blue.

1. GVWR: 6, 600#
2. The GAWR-Front: 3160
2A. Scaled front: 2,900
3. GAWR-Rear. 3900
3A. Scaled rear 2,640

3B. Scaled GVW: 5540 lbs

Note on scaled weights from Wayne: “Had a full tank of gas but I was the only passenger and I didn't have any camping equipment.”

4. The year: 2001
5. Model: Sequoia
6. Engine size: 4.7 liter V8
7. 2 wheel drive or 4 wheel drive: 4 wheel drive
8. Does it have the towing package ?
9. Truck rear axle ratio ?

10. GCWR. (Gross Combined Weight Rating) 11,800#
11. Wheel Base: 118.10” Found from here: 2001 Sequioa

Since your scaled weights did not have a passenger I’m going to add that in the end along with camping gear. If you are talking 1 passenger that is not going to break the bank. If you have a entire truck full, well let’s talk again on how many pounds we have for them.

Let’s look at what the truck can handle as far as axle loads.

TV Front axle rating – actual scaled: 3,160 – 2,900 = 260# before reaching the limit.
TV Rear axle rating – actual scaled: 3,900 – 2,640 = 1,260# before reaching the limit.

TV GVWR – Actual scaled GVW: 6,600 - 5,540 = 1,060# before reaching the limit.

From these 3 numbers we can see your sitting real close to the front axle rating. The rear axle has some room for weight however the GVWR is a limit factor that you should only add 1,060# or more cargo to the truck. In this case cargo is anything is weight, your passenger, your pop cooler, lunch box etc. Making an assumption here that your passenger and any camping must haves in the truck, your pop cooler etc add up to 200#. Having the 1,060 – 200# = 860# left for the camper tongue weight and hitch as a maximum. So now we know that the camper “loaded” tongue weight can be. Notice I emphasized loaded tongue weight not the brochure weight that has no gear in it yet. We also need to confirm the receiver on your truck is rated above 860# or that becomes the limiting factor in actual camper tongue weight. Some of the older smaller Toyota's only had a 750# WD rated receiver at least in the small pickups. You will have to confirm this.

Now lets look at the pull ratings. The truck and must have camper gear/people comes out to 5,540# + 200# must haves = 5,740# . Your GCWR is 11,800. Subtracting the 2 we get 11,800 – 5,740 = 6,060# the engine, transmission and rear axle is rated to pull.

Now we enter the TT frontal area wind drag reduction. I do not know if Toyota lists the actual reduction for frontal are of the trailer but it is common that 60 sq feet of area is a limit that once your above that limit pulling performance is affected. And just about any 8 foot wide free standing TT is over that limit. A Hi/Lo is not as it is lower to the ground. Basically putting it this “brick” we pull down the highway eats up power once we start going over about 45 mph and you can start to feel the loss. Think like your towing a big dead stump behind you as that is what it feels like the 1st time.

What we do is add what we call a safety factor or reserve factor now to account for the wind drag of a TT. Here bigger is better. Meaning the more reserve, safety factor you have the more enjoyable your towing will be and the longer your TV will not strain and work so hard.

Now comes the question, what is this reserve factor? I have not ever found one published for a TT. Some use 80% of your tow rating to size the trailer as they do not want to do all this math. Some times it fits well, some times not as well. From my experiences I have 20,000 plus miles towing at 12% less then the GCWR on a low profile non slide Sunline. On the high profile Sunline with a slide I have towed a short time (3,500 miles) at 2% less then GCWR and feared to never go in the winding hills of southern OH. Since we are talking a Sunline with a roof line swept back for better air flow I will pick the 12% rule. This is if you have some minor hills. If your into heavy mountains and gaining 1,000 or more plus feet above seal level the numbers needs to go up higher. AT ~ 8,600 feet you loose 2 cylinders of power on your V8 do to a gas non turbo/super charged engine.

So 12% less then 11,800# is 10,384 as your pulling limit with some reserve capacity. Now taking the pull limit of 10,384 – 5,740# TV and cargo = 4,644# for a TT. If you go to 10% less that ups the TT 236# or to 4,880#. I know this looks low and may raise many eyebrows but I can attest you will not be happy towing a 6,000# loaded TT very far or very long as that is the limit on your truck. I’m conservative in how I do this especially to a first time camper friend towing a TT.

Recapping:

Only add 200# to the truck for passengers and gear to stay within the GVWR of the truck. You can add more if your tongue weight goes down from 860#

The loaded tongue weight of the camper needs to be at or under the rating of your truck receiver. You will need to check that. This should not exceed 860# to stay at or under the GVWR on the truck. You have to use a WD hitch for these kind of tongue weights.

The loaded camper should be no more then 4,600 to 4,800# to have an enjoyable towing experience. The truck will work on hills but your towing a camper and a light truck will work on hills towing a camper. For a first time towing this will be a lot until your get use to it. It will be different then your pop up.

On a 4,600# camper with a 13% loaded tongue weight as an example that is 598# tongue weight. This creates stable towing and is under your 860# limit and odds are better under your receiver WD limit. Even if you are at 15% loaded tongue weight that is 690# tongue and those are still good numbers.

Since you have a shorter wheel base truck get a WD with a combined anti-sway system if you are up in the 4,600# TT. There are many brands out there that will work and are not that expensive. Can help on that too if needed.

Most any of the single axle Sunlines could fit as a big picture statement. Have to check for sure. In the dual axle versions looking at a year 2000 catalog for example the T 1950 has a dry weight of 3450# and a GVWR of 5,000 #. If you add 1,000# of gear that brings you to 4,450# which on paper fits. The T2053 also is in that range. The T2363 starts getting heavier and you may need to drop some gear because of it to stay in that 4500# range. The T2370 may also fit but that is already a 24 foot TT . Will need to carry light in the gear and for sure a good WD hitch and anti-sway control.

If you get one of the bigger ones I listed in time your next truck will be a bigger one. You can also ask around here on the forum with folks who have towed a T1950 or T2053 and what size truck they had. You at least have the V8 version however the smaller one.

I hope this helps and if you or anyone else sees an error please point it out.

Good luck

John
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Old 06-23-2011, 05:33 AM   #26
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Thanks for the reply. I would like to find a 2053. That for the present would allow me to camp and travel and still keep Susan happy.
Now I just have to find one.
Thanks again to all.
Wayne
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Old 06-23-2011, 08:44 AM   #27
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Very cool. It's great that John takes the time to really dial into these things. Being new to this, I just guestimated when we bought our trailer. What I didn't estimate properly was how much stuff we would bring with us. I probably should have known though as I was very familiar with the wife's packing style on other trips.

We had a 99 burb and believe it or not, the tow rating (Pound wise) is very similar to your Sequia. We put a 28 foot trailer on it because the sunline dry weight was listed at only 4500lbs roughly. Well, we ended up pretty much right at our rated weight for the vehicle and although I had no stability issues, it was a rough trip and I overheated the transmission. I could deal with the slow accelleration but stopping every 30 miles to cool off was a bit much.

Needless to say, we went to a bigger tow vehicle as getting rid of the trailer was obviously not an option. Now we're at about 60% of our max rating fully loaded and can't wait to head down to sanibel for the 4th.
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Old 06-23-2011, 08:28 PM   #28
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Wayne and Ohh

I hope this all helps and your very welcome. I do not mind doing this and I too end up learning something new all the time from it. I, like many others here on SOC learned how to sort out these numbers the hard way. There are many TT dealers that do not take the time to help explain this to you. You may get an hour walk thru on the TT and 2 minutes on a WD hitch and sure your can tow it on the truck. Not all dealers are this way, but the stories of too many doing it are all too often including the dealers I bought my 1st TT from.

So here on the camper forums we have no sale to make and only to help a fellow camper out try to sort this out in their head so they can make a better decision.

Good luck on your Sunline search. Keep digging one is bound to show up.

John
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