Towing T2499

[jsm5394]

3/4 ton it is. Thanks again. I’ll let you know what I find.

[BenB]

If you want to know anything about Avalanche 2500 or Suburban 2500 of the early 2000s let me know. I have a 2002 Avalanche 2500 I have completely gone though to make as reliable as possible for towing. I have tons of info for them and the Suburban 2500 of the same era. We have a T264SR with a 1200# tougue weight and it tows it great.

Henryj is right they are built on the same platform/wheelbase and a 1500 would probably be worse than your current Suburban. The 1500s are coil spring rear axles which gives a softer ride but don't handle the heavy loads as well, the 2500 have leaf spring rears.

You can typically find a Avalanche/Suburban 2500 cheaper than a regular 3/4 pickup of the same era, the contractors usually don't want so the prices aren't as high. Once in a while you find gem out there,, saw a beautiful 2005 Suburban 2500 with 67k miles recently for $15,000. It looked brand new.

[jsm5394]

I’m still looking for a 2500. If I could find a decent one for $15k I’d jump on it. Hard to find so far. I read that the 6.0 pulls similar to the 8.1 but gets 20% Better mileage when not towing. Do you agree? Should I avoid the 8.1? What about the fords? F250’s appear less expensive than the Chevys.

On another note: the trailer came with a WD hitch but no sway control. It’s a Reese 54917, 12,000 lb 1200 lb tongue rated. What sway control should I add?

Again my sincere thanks for all the great advice. I really appreciate you and this forum.

Jim M

[roger66ogden]

Wow excellent information. I have a 3/4 08 ram and it has a full floating axle meaning there are 2 wheel bearings per hub and the axle housing carries the weight that is placed on it not like the 1/2 ton standard axles that only have one bearing per hub and the weight that is being placed on it is split between the housing and the axle shaft itself.

Roger

[jsm5394]

I thought I posted this earlier but don’t see it.

I have a Reese 54917 weight hitch but no sway control. What do you recommend?

[BenB]

Originally Posted by jsm5394

I’m still looking for a 2500. If I could find a decent one for $15k I’d jump on it. Hard to find so far. I read that the 6.0 pulls similar to the 8.1 but gets 20% Better mileage when not towing. Do you agree? Should I avoid the 8.1? What about the fords? F250’s appear less expensive than the Chevys.

On another note: the trailer came with a WD hitch but no sway control. It’s a Reese 54917, 12,000 lb 1200 lb tongue rated. What sway control should I add?

Again my sincere thanks for all the great advice. I really appreciate you and this forum.

Jim M

Jim, I can't confirm if the 6.0L gets 20% better mileage than the 8.1L or not, but that seems high to me, I wouldn’t think it’s that much more efficient. JohnB had a 2003 Suburban 2500 with the 6.0L/4.10 rear and a T2499, I am sure he has real MPG numbers for that. There is a couple factors that go along with the 8.1L that make the setup a little different than 6.0L. I can tell my you Avalanche 8.1L/3.73 rear will get about 8mpg towing our approx 8000# T264SR and also have towed a T2475 approx 4500# at about 9.5mpg. This is mostly about wind resistance, as I have also towed a truck on a flatbed trailer 400 miles that was about 7800# and got about 11.5mpg. Just some numbers I can confirm to give you an idea.

The few things that are different from a 6.0L and 8.1L are the transmission on the GMT800 series trucks (approx 2000-2006 model years). The Suburban 2500 6.0L had a 4L80E; the Suburban/Avalanche 2500 8.1L had a 4L85E (all Avalanche 2500 had the 8.1L). The 2500/3500 pickups with the 6.0L had the 4L80E and the 8.1L got the Allison. The early trucks the Allison was a 5 speed, the 06-07 trucks got the 6 speed. So depending on the model year the engine/trans/rear combo the mpg numbers could vary. This will also change the towing rating and GCVW (truck plus trailer weight) ratings of each.

Either Ford or Chevy each truck had it own “problems” they were just different. The Ford 4.6/5.4/6.8L 2 valve and 3 valve had their common problem as did the Chevys. Can help advise what to look for in each if you narrow down on one.

On your Resse hitch do you have picture? It looks like part number 54917 is just the drawbar part number not the whole system. Most likely if its Reese you can add a Dual Cam Sway control to it. These work very well if setup correctly, we have used on several of our Sunlines from 4500-10000#

[BenB]

Originally Posted by BenB

Jim, I can't confirm if the 6.0L gets 20% better mileage than the 8.1L or not, but that seems high to me, I wouldn’t think it’s that much more efficient.

To clarify my thoughts of this I don't think in a towing situation it would be 20% better, it may be possible driving the truck without a trailer. Best I have gotten not towing with my Avalanche is 14mpg, but it is my tow/haul truck. I rarely drive it without a trailer behind it or a lumberyard load in the bed.

[jsm5394]

Here are a couple pics. Is friction ok or should I go dual cam?

I found a 2004 Avalanche 2500 with 45k miles. One owner, clean carfax. Over book though. Just shy if $20k. Can’t find them though. Any advice?

[BenB]

Originally Posted by jsm5394

Here are a couple pics. Is friction ok or should I go dual cam?



I found a 2004 Avalanche 2500 with 45k miles. One owner, clean carfax. Over book though. Just shy if $20k. Can’t find them though. Any advice?

I didn't see any pics of the hitch, they may have not posted correctly. 20k may be over book, but as I'm sure you have found trying to find a 3/4 ton or 1/2 even with only 45k miles for close to 20k is difficult. What state is the Avalanche in? Most all the problems I had with mine were rust related, as you will find with any GM truck from 1999-2006. The brake lines are super common to rust out, fuel lines as well. With that low miles it may have been garage kept, pay attention to the frame and underbody, the rockers are what usually rust first. The drivetrain likely has no issues with that low miles. My father in law had 2 of these trucks, one with 150k miles and one with 225k, and he had a supercharger. Engine never had any problems, other than the standard oil consumption. The 8.1L with consume oil, GM actually says a quart every 1000 miles or so is normal. Other fun fact, 3/4 ton Avalanche and Suburbans have and extra fuel tank, 37.5 gal total, makes it nice for towing, just hurts your wallet filling up all at once.

If getting any GM truck from 99-06 I would suggest a hitch upgrade, the stock hitches are known to flex/twist bad. This is worse on the Avalanche/Suburban because of how it is attached to the rear frame. Can get more into this if you buy. I actually bent my frame slighty with the WD. I was using an aftermarket hitch, but if I had known I would have bought the one I have now to begin with, most likely wouldn't have had that problem, and cost the same.

[jsm5394]

I found a 2004!Avalanche 2500 one owner 45k miles, clean Carfax for $20k. 8.1, 4 speed, 3.75, tow package. I’m going to look at it tomorrow. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Jim M

[BenB]

Originally Posted by jsm5394

I found a 2004!Avalanche 2500 one owner 45k miles, clean Carfax for $20k. 8.1, 4 speed, 3.75, tow package. I’m going to look at it tomorrow. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks,
Jim M

I replaced fuel lines, brake lines, transmission lines and repaired rocker panels due to rust, inspect these and the frame. I replaced the power steering and oil cooler lines due to leaks, they start to seep where the rubber is crimped to the hard line. I replaced the exhaust manifold gaskets because they rusted out, this will show as a ticking nosie from the engine bay, very noticeable when accelerating. That's all I remember major quickly, other stuff was normal maintenance other than the hitch upgrade. The bed covers do leak some, worse as they age, some better than others.

Its a great truck, 8ft bed for lumberyard runs, and crew cab with lockable bed storage the rest of the time. Plenty of pulling power it gets almost the entire full 455ft/lb of torque at like 2000rpm.

[henryj]

Originally Posted by jsm5394

I found a 2004!Avalanche 2500 one owner 45k miles, clean Carfax for $20k. 8.1, 4 speed, 3.75, tow package.

My neighbor has that exact same Avalanche since new and is obviously still very happy with it. Its had yearly oil sprays and is in excellent condition, but has spent most winters towing a trailer around FL. You can very quickly tell a lot about a used truck before taking the time for a detailed inspection. If the factory Al wheels are in good shape, the truck hasn't seen much salt. If it has a decent set of tires, relatively unblemished exterior, an interior that shows only 45K of wear rather than 17 yr and an exceptionally clean rear seat and floor; it likely hasn't seen much if any abuse from kids and pets and an owner that looked after the visuals almost certainly did the maintenance in good time as well.

Low mileage trucks of that vintage often belonged to elderly RVers and can be a very good buy.

Henry

[jsm5394]

Ben,
Thanks for the advice. The truck was pretty decent but has a passengers side manifold issue. Dealer said he didn’t notice it before (yeah right). He’s bringing it into the shop. My bet is that it has a cracked manifold and that’s why it was sold.
Jim

[BenB]

Mine the rear stud broke off on the passenger side causing it to tick. The exhaust hangs heavy on that side. GM went to smaller exhaust studs for the 8.1L the and the 5.3/6.0L, they all have the same common problem. I bought it that way, dealer thought it was a lifter issue, I think they didn't want to fix it and other things, sold it to me at wholesale price.

[jsm5394]

Didn’t that hurt power and the already poor mpg? If no downside other than the ticking I could offer low price.

I’m having a hard time finding a 3/4 in decent shape under $30k. Some F150’s have pretty good towing numbers. Do you think that’s an option?

Jim M

[henryj]

What year? Towing numbers mean nothing. You need at least 1800lb of payload from the yellow door sticker. Our F150 is 1853lb, but that's factory. Owner accessories like a tonneau etc. deduct from that. Our '15 Silverado was 2152lb.

[jsm5394]

Henry, I don’t have a year in mind. Just looking for something to tow my 2004 T-2499. Need extended cab for the dogs. Hoping to keep to $20k. I know I should have 3/4 ton but can’t find it. Wondering if I can get by with a 1/2 ton and if so which.

[henryj]

Have you tried autotrader.com? I just did a used car search in Albany selecting F150 from the popups with a max price of $24,000 and there are quite a few. $24,000 will get you into the 2012 model which is considered by some to be one of the best. In the left margin of the page you can really fine tune the truck you're looking for, expand the search radius, change the price range, option packages etc. The catch is there's a good chance a number of these trucks have already been sold and will be listed until the owner's ad expires. Try other searches for different makes and 3/4 ton, but boy I couldn't find much in 3/4 ton either.

1/2 ton GVWRs can be all over the map and Ford is one of the worst. Look for some towing options, 1800lb payload, at least 3800lb rear axle and 7000lb GVWR. All numbers are on two stickers on the driver's door or door jamb--yellow payload and tire sticker and silver VIN and axle sticker.

Henry

[BenB]

Originally Posted by jsm5394

Didn’t that hurt power and the already poor mpg? If no downside other than the ticking I could offer low price.

I’m having a hard time finding a 3/4 in decent shape under $30k. Some F150’s have pretty good towing numbers. Do you think that’s an option?

Jim M

Didn't hurt power, just an anonyoance. Drove it that way for a while until it got really loud.

If looking at a 1/2 ton pay attention to the GCVR (This is truck plus trailer) there was no standards to the older tow numbers, the MFGs didn't adopt an equal standard until sometime around 2015. They can post big tow numbers by in theory reducing the weight of the stuff in the truck, usually only adding driver weight. To get that big tow number the truck has to be empty and low optioned. If you have a truck loaded with options and want to put people and gear in it, that takes away from tow capacity. A 3/4 ton will give you more cushion, but could possibly be done in a 1/2 ton just have to check the numbers.

[henryj]

This scale ticket is essentially identical to what a 2499 would be with a 1500 truck

IMG_2622.jpg

This is our '19 F150 and Arctic Fox, but even an older 2000's 1500 would weigh like this. The difference between them is the late model has GCWR of about 18,000 lb.; the old one about 12,000 lb. Stucturally there's no reason for the difference in GCWR, but any late model 1/2 ton could have 400 hp and a 10 sp trans and that's why it's towing ability is so much better. Any older 1500 should tow at least as well as your '99 Sub, but try to get at least a 3.55 axle ratio and always check for at least 1800 lb. payload and at least 7000 lb. GVWR.

Our F150 is 700 lb. under GVWR, 730 lb. under RGAWR and more than 7000 lb. under GCWR and this is what makes the sweet spot for a combination. The closer you get to GVWR and GCWR the more unpleasant the towing experience becomes.

Henry