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Old 02-02-2011, 11:40 AM   #1
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Angry heater problem again...

my 1988 sunline seville heater has worked great until a couple nights ago.thought it had ran out of propane and had bottles filled. wouldn't lite so reset it .it then lit but after it had cycled off and then back on it would not re-lite, just blew cold..have tried reseting many times and sometimes it will lite but not cycle properly.have cleaned all air intakes. any help will be appreciated..thanks
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Old 02-02-2011, 08:33 PM   #2
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Hi Jeff

Do you have a model number of the heater? I'm assuming it is a Hydroflame if not what make is it?

I can give you some "basic" info that applies to many of the Hydroflame units. I can't tell for sure this fits your model from 1988 but it could be right on or close.

I'm assuming the fan turns on and off when you turn the T stat up and down, Correct?

Now to the heat itself.

Need to know some things about your 12 VDC. Are you running off a battery only or are you plugged into shore power using the converter and a battery, or a converter and no battery? Do you have a volt meter you can test the battery voltage?

Reason for asking this is there is a saftey in the furnace called a sail switch. This is sort of like a paddle switch hanging inside the blower housing that the wind power of the fan pushes the paddle and then makes the circuit to allow the ignigtion to lite and gas valve to come on. If you have low voltage the fan does not run as fast as normal and then the sail switch does not make leaving the fan blowing at a lower speed but no heat.

If your converter is not working right or sometimes is and sometimes is not the 12 VDC can fluctuate up and down and so can the sail switch by the fan speed.

With a volt meter check the battery voltage with no shore power plugged in meaning the converter is not on and do not turn on anything in the camper to draw battery power. The propane detector may be on but that is OK. So what is the battery voltage? If the converter was on up until your shut it down and then test the voltage it may be up in the 13 volt area as a surface charge exists boosting the voltage. If you are on just battery for a long time, 8 hours etc, then if the voltage is down in the 12.2 area that means you could be 1/2 discharged. If it read 12.6 or 12.7 then your battery is just about full if not fully charged. Again this is with a battery at rest and has not been on a converter or charge in the last 8 hrs.

When you plug the converter in it should be in the 13.25 area if your converter has a float mode or in the 13.6 area if it is charging the battery. If you have much any thing in voltage above 12.5 volts you should have enough power to run the fan fast enough to make the sail switch. Now it will work at some lower voltage but again, if the converter is working and on you should be well above 12.5 and in the 13 volt plus range.

Next possibility that may line up with part of your comments with it is not cycling right. If the battery voltage is OK then do you have a heat duct or 2 that are blocked or the air intake blocked in the camper? In side the unit there is a temperature cut off switch (high limit) on the main heat chamber. When the heat chamber gets hot enough it opens up the temp cut off switch and shuts the gas off. If the heat ducts are blocked the unit can over heat and then not cycle very well as it is going into overheat too quick. This will also happen if the outside air inlet or exhaust duct is partially plugged.

Not knowing your model and if it has the diagnostics board of the newer ones, the newer ones have an LED on the main control board that can give some ideas to what is not working right.

You can see here on the newer models. If you take the grill cover off outside, you will see the motor compartment and a circuit board. This one is one of mine and it is what it looks like with the cover off. Yours I'm sure is not this new or may not even look at all like this. But if you have a circuit board I would look here behind the outdoor grill.


If it has a circuit board sensing system it may have a decal to count the number of blinks on the board LED to tell that fault code it is throwing.


I would start with the battery voltage 1st and make sure you have not blocked any inside or outside heat ducts. If the outside exhaust/intake is partially plugged the unit can overheat and trip the high limit switch as well.

Hope this helps and let us know some more info to better point you in the right direction of where to go hunting.

John

PS, do you hear the igniter clicking but not firing the flame? It is hard to hear over the blower but if you listen real close you can hear it when it is clicking.
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Old 02-03-2011, 10:19 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnB View Post
Hi Jeff

Do you have a model number of the heater? I'm assuming it is a Hydroflame if not what make is it?

I can give you some "basic" info that applies to many of the Hydroflame units. I can't tell for sure this fits your model from 1988 but it could be right on or close.

I'm assuming the fan turns on and off when you turn the T stat up and down, Correct?

Now to the heat itself.

Need to know some things about your 12 VDC. Are you running off a battery only or are you plugged into shore power using the converter and a battery, or a converter and no battery? Do you have a volt meter you can test the battery voltage?

Reason for asking this is there is a saftey in the furnace called a sail switch. This is sort of like a paddle switch hanging inside the blower housing that the wind power of the fan pushes the paddle and then makes the circuit to allow the ignigtion to lite and gas valve to come on. If you have low voltage the fan does not run as fast as normal and then the sail switch does not make leaving the fan blowing at a lower speed but no heat.

If your converter is not working right or sometimes is and sometimes is not the 12 VDC can fluctuate up and down and so can the sail switch by the fan speed.

With a volt meter check the battery voltage with no shore power plugged in meaning the converter is not on and do not turn on anything in the camper to draw battery power. The propane detector may be on but that is OK. So what is the battery voltage? If the converter was on up until your shut it down and then test the voltage it may be up in the 13 volt area as a surface charge exists boosting the voltage. If you are on just battery for a long time, 8 hours etc, then if the voltage is down in the 12.2 area that means you could be 1/2 discharged. If it read 12.6 or 12.7 then your battery is just about full if not fully charged. Again this is with a battery at rest and has not been on a converter or charge in the last 8 hrs.

When you plug the converter in it should be in the 13.25 area if your converter has a float mode or in the 13.6 area if it is charging the battery. If you have much any thing in voltage above 12.5 volts you should have enough power to run the fan fast enough to make the sail switch. Now it will work at some lower voltage but again, if the converter is working and on you should be well above 12.5 and in the 13 volt plus range.

Next possibility that may line up with part of your comments with it is not cycling right. If the battery voltage is OK then do you have a heat duct or 2 that are blocked or the air intake blocked in the camper? In side the unit there is a temperature cut off switch (high limit) on the main heat chamber. When the heat chamber gets hot enough it opens up the temp cut off switch and shuts the gas off. If the heat ducts are blocked the unit can over heat and then not cycle very well as it is going into overheat too quick. This will also happen if the outside air inlet or exhaust duct is partially plugged.

Not knowing your model and if it has the diagnostics board of the newer ones, the newer ones have an LED on the main control board that can give some ideas to what is not working right.

You can see here on the newer models. If you take the grill cover off outside, you will see the motor compartment and a circuit board. This one is one of mine and it is what it looks like with the cover off. Yours I'm sure is not this new or may not even look at all like this. But if you have a circuit board I would look here behind the outdoor grill.


If it has a circuit board sensing system it may have a decal to count the number of blinks on the board LED to tell that fault code it is throwing.


I would start with the battery voltage 1st and make sure you have not blocked any inside or outside heat ducts. If the outside exhaust/intake is partially plugged the unit can overheat and trip the high limit switch as well.

Hope this helps and let us know some more info to better point you in the right direction of where to go hunting.

John

PS, do you hear the igniter clicking but not firing the flame? It is hard to hear over the blower but if you listen real close you can hear it when it is clicking.
it has proper voltage, I cleaned all the ducts, I can hear the igniter click but the burner is not firing.. at this point it isn't starting at all any more..the stove and oven are working fine..
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Old 02-03-2011, 10:23 AM   #4
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it has proper voltage, I cleaned all the ducts/intakes..I can hear the igniter click but it doesn't fire the burner..at this point it won't start at all anymore..the stove and oven are working fine...BTW it is a hydroflame/atwood
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Old 02-03-2011, 10:45 AM   #5
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it has proper voltage, I cleaned all the ducts/intakes..I can hear the igniter click but it doesn't fire the burner..at this point it won't start at all anymore..the stove and oven are working fine...BTW it is a hydroflame/atwood
Jeff, any chance of a model number so I can look it up? I do not know what was installed in 1988.

If you are sure you can hear it clicking for ignition that means all the safeties are made. This now point to the gas valve or the control module feeding the gas valve.

Do you have 12 volts on the gas valve when it is clicking? This at least mean the control module is sending power. Does yours have the LED on a control board to tell what type of fault may be occurring?

If valve has power and is actually working then it may be possible you have a plugged gas pipe. Depending on how the camper is piped, if the furnace is the last leg in the run or has a low dip in the gas pipe on the way to the furnace, any crud or oil from flexible rubber hose collects in these places. While only 11” WC gas pressure it will not push pout much of a clog.

On any gas line you open up, use leak solution on when putting it back together.

Can you feel the exhaust air blowing outside the camper? Meaning you do not have some kind of clogged up combustion chamber.

Good luck and hope this helps

John
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Old 02-03-2011, 05:04 PM   #6
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model #8531-11 w/out LED..furnace is second in line from tanks
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Old 02-03-2011, 08:03 PM   #7
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in my 95 sunline if the battery is weak or not fully charged the furnce will lite cycle once but will not cycle again why i dont have a clue but if the batter is charged or if its plugged in to 30 or 50 amp it works great for days hope this helps
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Old 02-03-2011, 09:58 PM   #8
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model #8531-11 w/out LED..furnace is second in line from tanks
This may help. His lighting problems sound similar.

Woodalls Open Roads Forum: Tech Issues: Hydro flame Furnace help

I did find a service manual for a 8531-111. Do not know the difference between a 8531-11 and a 8531-111

http://bryantrv.com/docs2/docs/hflameservice.pdf

See if that helps. My own furnace in the house stopped working tonight so it has consumed my evening.

Good luck and please report back what you find.

John
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Old 02-05-2011, 11:23 AM   #9
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still haven't figured it out.. took circuit board in and had it tested, told me it was bad so 135.00 later still not working..got gas, got spark, got green light, got fan, got no heat.. UUUUGGGH
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Old 02-05-2011, 02:09 PM   #10
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Is there a distance your spark needs to be from the gas valve? I mean is there a special setting for the ignitor electrodes? Spark that is not in the proper place might be the same as no spark.

Electrodes might wear away from sparking and need to be readjusted.

jim
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Old 02-05-2011, 07:18 PM   #11
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thanks everyone for your insight..I pulled the burner out and it is pretty tattered so I'm gonna try to get one on Monday...thanks again (I just hope I didn't buy a circuit board for nothing)
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Old 02-05-2011, 07:22 PM   #12
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Glad you found something.

As fyi this is what the newer ones look like




While your in there, take a flashlight and look deep into the combustion chamber for any "things" that are not suppose to be in there.

Good luck and keep us posted

John
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Old 02-06-2011, 04:11 AM   #13
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When buying parts always take the old one to compare against the new part. And, always keep your old part, ffr.
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