Camping World manager trashed Sunlines

FiveORacing · 07-15-2013, 02:54 PM

I went to my local Camping World today to buy some supplies. I had just washed the roof on my recently purchased trailer and it had some stains on it and I wanted to asked him about how to remove them. When I first mentioned Sunline, he stopped me and said,

"Oh, Sunline? Worst roofs in the RV industry. Basically they were a thin layer of rubber glued to a piece of corrugated cardboard. The roofs were the reason Sunline went out of business."

I told him that I has a couple of ripples in my roof where it looked like the material was pulled too tight and puckered in the corner, but no signs of leaks anywhere, and he said,

"Water has gotten under there and delaminated the roof. You will need a new roof soon. He said the smallest pinhole and the cardboard soaks in the water and delaminates the roof. "

I just thanked him for making me feel like crap, and asked could he answer my question about the stains.

Are the ripples anything I should be concerned with? The edges are all tight and the Dicor caulk looks good.

mainah · 07-15-2013, 06:31 PM

There is a Camping World that bought out a local dealer recently near me the owner actually worked for them for awhile and quit! She said she could not treat her old customers like that. Another dealer 2 miles away some of the nicest people you would ever like to meet said Camping World has been great for their business they now have more work then they can handle so I would not pay too much attention to what they have to say. I don't buy any thing from them because I can usually get it on line cheaper. To me they are the WalMart of the camping industry.

**Sunline Fan** · 07-15-2013, 09:20 PM

They are like Walmart. While I do believe that Sunline's roof design was far from superior, it definitely served a purpose. It was designed to be lightweight yet strong. In recent years though, walk-on roofs became much more important, but Sunline really didn't follow the times unless someone wanted to pay the upcharge.

Not the sole reason for them going out of business, but it was another nail in their coffin.

**Tweety** · 07-16-2013, 04:44 AM

While it's not convenient that you can't walk on the Sunline roof, if you maintain it properly it should last for years. No, "bud board" isn't as durable as plywood. But if you keep the rubber roof free of holes and gaps you should be fine.

Capt Skup · 07-16-2013, 07:21 AM

While what the CW manager told you is painful, unfortunately I think he was right about the roofs. I have had to have a total roof replacement on a well cared for Sunline. It is sad to see what is under that rubber membrane. Not much. I luckily found an independent rv repairman to gut the roof, install 5/8" treated plywood and lay down a new membrane. Seeing wet cardboard is sure depressing. I don't think the roof issues ran Sunline out of business. I was at the factory near the end and met the "new" owners. Got the impression they were there to gut the company and extract as much money out of it and run.
How to Spot a Lemon when Buying an RV - YouTube
I posted this video earlier, mine was no where near as bad as this one but if I had not caught it in time, the results would have been the same.

Anita1 · 07-16-2013, 08:48 AM

Yeah, I was stupid like that buyer. The guy said that everything was great but I have two soft spots in the floor too. One by a window in a corner (not where a person walks) and another behind the toilet (just like in the video.) He had most of the floor covered up with rugs. We have inspected the roof and recaulked some areas and we haven't found any new water yet. We looked under the closet/behind the drawer. It doesn't smell moldy in the camper...except the bathroom closet smells a little. I really sniffed the air to ensure that the camper was not moldy but the guy had all the windows open and like I said, the camper itself does not smell moldy. I did smell something in the closet but that seems kind of common for camper closets. oh well. Not really sure what we plan on doing except I do know that if we sell it we won't lie to the next person.

I get the drift of what this guy is saying about buying from someone's backyard but I noticed a lot of used campers at the dealers lots with the same problems and in worse shape than mine. I can't imagine that they tell you the truth on everything either.

I live in Wisconsin and I would guess that a lot of camper damage comes from being stored outside in winter. The weight of the snow has to be horrible for a camper roof.

At any rate, the video makes a person want to purchase only new campers.

Capt Skup · 07-16-2013, 08:55 AM

The reason we still have our 10 year old is that we cannot find a new rv built much different, and many much worse. I keep telling my wife, if only we could find an rv built as well as our SeaRay boat. Just going to have to keep saving for a Tiffen Motorhome.

FiveORacing · 07-16-2013, 10:05 AM

Well this is all pretty discouraging. I was hoping that I would hear about how far off base he was. I guess not. Now I can't help but think maybe I shouldn't invest a lot of time and money into this rig? I buy and sell a lot of cars but don't have much experience with used trailers. The only other one I ever owned was brand new and I kept it for only two years. I checked this trailer over carefully and found no evidence of leaks. It's basically brand new inside with nothing soft anywhere. The interior of the cabinets are solid and clean. I pulled the inside trim off the vents and the luan looks brand new and the few tufts of insulation I see are pink and dry. The Dicor has been maintained and looks really good. It has been overcoated with a second layer in most areas and the original is just now showing the early signs of drying out.

What has me worried is the one 18 inch wide, one inch high, football shaped bubble behind the rearmost vent, and the slight ripples in the corners, like a bedsheet that wasn't tucked flat. I've reached across the roof without getting on it and I can press it down until it reached the inner plywood (cardboard?) Is this just the beginning of a major issue as the guy said, or is this something that's pretty common and just happens or did water get in there at some point?

Thanks

Joe

janepete · 07-16-2013, 11:22 AM

Joe, here is a link to a conversation I had about a camper we looked at to buy. It might help. We took a pass because the multitude of bubbles. I think if you have one and the substrate feels firm, I'd try to fix it and not be too concerned. I think the worst places are at seams and around openings. Feel around and see if the roof feels bottomless.
Jane
http://www.sunlineclub.com/forums/f7...are-11298.html

jim44646 · 07-16-2013, 12:26 PM

The one tool I did buy was a moisture meter, not very expensive.
Periodically I go around bottom perimeter and probe for moisture. If I find excessive moisture I really start resealing everything that looks suspicious.
As far as the bubble, I ,if it were me would slit it , and put contact cement under the rubber membrane to re adhere it. Then clean area good and put an Eternabond patch over slit.

FiveORacing · 07-16-2013, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by janepete

Joe, here is a link to a conversation I had about a camper we looked at to buy. It might help. We took a pass because the multitude of bubbles. I think if you have one and the substrate feels firm, I'd try to fix it and not be too concerned. I think the worst places are at seams and around openings. Feel around and see if the roof feels bottomless.
Jane
http://www.sunlineclub.com/forums/f7...are-11298.html

The roof feels like a trampoline, but from what I've read, that's about normal. I walked around on the rafters and if I push down between them it has give but it's just that it's not that strong. There is a small patch 3 x 3 inches where a tree branch hit it and I can feel the hole in the budboard under it. Not very strong stuff at all.

The trailer doesn't have any water damage, but I wish I had know this before I bought it.

Maybe I'll have someone replace the underlayment with something stronger and put a new sheet of rubber over it? Anyone in the Jersey area?

jim44646 · 07-16-2013, 03:46 PM

[QUOTE=FiveORacing;115491]The roof feels like a trampoline, but from what I've read, that's about normal. I walked around on the rafters and if I push down between them it has give but it's just that it's not that strong. There is a small patch 3 x 3 inches where a tree branch hit it and I can feel the hole in the budboard under it. Not very strong stuff at all.QUOTE]
Do not walk on roof their not meant to be walked on. They made them that way to reduce weight. If You need to do work up there toss a piece of carpet up there fuzzy side down for protection and lay a 1/2" thick piece of plywood on carpet to spread out your weight. Here's a couple links to help you know with what your dealing with.
http://www.sunlineclub.com/forums/f7...1-a-11508.html

http://www.sunlineclub.com/forums/f7...ics-11610.html

FiveORacing · 07-16-2013, 05:11 PM

Yeah, I had a two big squares of thick plastic I laid down. All done for now, I'll have to address it at some point, I'm sure.

**Sunline Fan** · 07-16-2013, 10:12 PM

That is a thorough video. I think I'll share it on the Facebook page. I agree with all points except for the rusty screws on the bottom of the sidewall- those exposed screws have little paint on them in the first place, so they will start to rust on the outside early. The ones under the screwcover though, I agree.

This trailer is at a dealer in Florida, and probably spent its whole life in Florida. Looking at the decals though, it definitely had some protection on it of some sort. But the roof probably had a lot more sun than usual, which deteriorated the seams much quicker than normal.

I have seen quite a bit of water damage before, but never one this bad, especially not on a 2000.

I've seen some minor corrosion before, actually on my '98, but it wasn't nearly this bad. I think some of this is salt air related.

Sad but true reality of the future of many Sunlines.

**Tweety** · 07-17-2013, 06:42 AM

Our 2753 roof corners were not flat. They had the wrinkles you describe. I always thought that was just from it being difficult to wrap over the edge at the corners. Steve checked the edges twice a year and made sure the dicor was intact. If you keep water out you aren't going to have a problem. The football shaped area sound suspicious, but it may just be a little pulled away there and perfectly dry underneath. The video is terrible, but with impropper care any trailer can leak and water would run down the walls whether the roof is plywood or bud board under there. Don't be disturbed, just be vigilant and enjoy your trailer

underdog · 07-17-2013, 09:45 AM

Just out of curiosity, what about the older ones, like my 90, with a metal roof. Can you walk up there or is it the same construction? It has had a section in the rear replaced and I don't see any leaks. We were in a lot of rain out in Norwalk and I never saw any signs of leakage. Not that I want to, I'm afraid of heights but just wondering.

Years ago, with my old Motorhome, I did a fair bit of business with Camping World. Recently I ordered a couple items from them. I found the prices no bargain and shipping was slow. For mailorder these days, I usually get the item # and goggle it. Chances are Amazon or an ebay store has the best deal.

Poppy & Nana · 07-17-2013, 02:47 PM

Our 2499 had wrinkles in the corners also.....we just checked the roof and monitored it for any changes.....

**Sunline Fan** · 07-17-2013, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by underdog

Just out of curiosity, what about the older ones, like my 90, with a metal roof. Can you walk up there or is it the same construction? It has had a section in the rear replaced and I don't see any leaks. We were in a lot of rain out in Norwalk and I never saw any signs of leakage. Not that I want to, I'm afraid of heights but just wondering.

Nope, no different. In fact, I'm not sure they had the bud board, it might have just been the aluminum over the rafters/insulation. They definitely didn't have any sort of plywood or paneling except the ceiling panel you see inside.

Generally, the aluminum should be a little stronger to hold your weight, but I'd still put boards between the rafters. The plus side is you don't need to worry about putting carpet down to protect the rubber.

mainah · 07-18-2013, 06:04 AM

Maybe the roof lacks a little but there was no reason for the guy at Camping World to talk to the OP the way he did a reasonable manager would have explained how it was built and offered suggestions on how to go about repairing the roof or keeping it from leaking not saying "your an idiot for even buying a Sunline" or what ever you happened to own that may have a design flaw. That sort of behavior is among one of the reasons I will not deal with Camping World I am not a "member" of their club so I don't get the "deals" on parts. Yeah such a deal I can buy the same part from a local family store for about the same price and be treated like a valued customer. End of rant can you tell I don't like Camping World?

FiveORacing · 07-18-2013, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mainah

Maybe the roof lacks a little but there was no reason for the guy at Camping World to talk to the OP the way he did a reasonable manager would have explained how it was built and offered suggestions on how to go about repairing the roof or keeping it from leaking not saying "your an idiot for even buying a Sunline" or what ever you happened to own that may have a design flaw. That sort of behavior is among one of the reasons I will not deal with Camping World I am not a "member" of their club so I don't get the "deals" on parts. Yeah such a deal I can buy the same part from a local family store for about the same price and be treated like a valued customer. End of rant can you tell I don't like Camping World?

That was one of the points of my post, other than hoping to get some contradictory info. I've obsessed over it for the last few days, and he really made me feel sick. I've come to the conclusion the roof is fine for now, it's not leaking, but it does have some broken substrate under the rubber, I will probably have at least the rear section torn off, re-decked properly and recovered. At least the rear portion will be walk-on when I'm done.

I may even reach out to the guy in WV and see if he can do a partial roof for me?

I really think Sunline made a poor choice to build roofs that light and cheap. I think a lot of companies run past dollars chasing pennies and it seems to bite them in the end. If a walk-on roof was an option, they should have just made them all that way.