Saturn T-2161 remodeling thoughts. Help us think it through please.

[Erin]

What is it about these Sunlines! You fall in love with them once you have one. We have had our Saturn T-2161 for about 5 years. It was our first trailer and we love it. Have no desire to trade in or up. But....now that we've had it we know what we like and don't like. We are pretty handy. We have already basically gutted and remodeled our home and now we want to take on our next project of basically gutting the Saturn. I am so excited.

My husbands wants a larger bed and I want a smaller kitchen area. Here are the thoughts/wants and any input on what we may not have thought of would be appreciated. Knowledge of a stationary home is very different than our dear Sunline! Little things like 'how hard is it to move the converter' are answers we have no idea on...maybe that is a hard thing who knows!

We are giving ourselves about 18 months to get this done. Yup, giving up this coming summer camping. Hopefully the payoff and fun of the journey will be worth it. I am the construction and design guru, my husband is the electrician and plumber. We are just now in the planning and talking stages. The goal is to not touch the bathroom but gut and revamp everything else.

We want to change from a full oven to drop in burners only, go to a smaller under cabinet fridge, better sink & upgrade to an on demand water heater. We plan on moving the location of the bed and living area and dependent on what we find when we open her up maybe move around the kitchen a bit. With only the two of us in such a small trailer we also intend on doing away with the bathroom sink and just having the kitchen. We also plan on removing permanently the fresh water tank since we never go boondocking.

If money is left over she might get a paint job on the outside and perhaps new decals.

We know a lot cannot be truly planned until we have our open space and can make sure we have no structural issues.

Any thoughts from experience would be helpful.

Thanks!
Erin

PS- I know some would think us crazy- this 'project' is our 25th anniversary gift to each other. We want it done by that anniversary next year to take a maiden voyage in it.

[Drake]

You know...life is short and then you die! If you guys have the urge to do this, and the vision to rethink the space to suit your own needs and taste, then why not do it ??? I would say that you should familiarize yourselves with what you can and cannot do, and then make your plans. Supposedly the arrangements of appliances and furniture were given some serious thought by the Sunline folks prior to installing them, so before rearranging, you should know why something is located where it is located, what will change if you relocate it, and if you have the skills/tools necessary to make the change required. Moving the converter for instance, may be a job you have no desire to take on, so allowances would have to be made in your design for this. Extending the run of LP gas lines may be a pain as well. Prior to tearing out what you have, I would suggest you do a close examination of what is involved with installing what you want in the same space. Discovering that the water heater must be moved if you want to achieve your design wishes AFTER you have torn out the cabinets that were around it, would be a downer. Good luck!!!

[Jim-Bev-2363]

I would find a ready made unit closer to our needs. Several reasons to not rebuild your old TT:

1- You will make your TT depreciate by changing the layout to less popular/useable spaces.

2- You will spend money for parts/materials that could be better spent on actual camping fees.

3- If money is no object, labor is no problem then consider the time taken from the camping season. It cannot be replaced.


I would spend time camping and looking a more suitable TT with a bigger bed since that seems to be the one real problem.

Good luck with whatever you do.

[jim44646]

When manufactures design a trailer they calculate load behind the axle over the axle and in front of axle. ie. tongue weight. Changing thing may disrupt the handling characteristics of trailer making it unsafe to tow

[JohnB]

A total camper rebuild is an undertaking. We have had a few folks do this and they have come out very well. The time length of a year is a good target unless your retired with time on your hands. And even then it may take a year once construction starts.

Amazing how much time one can spend working on such a small space...

I myself may do the "ultimate mod" of a rebuild of the camper from the ground up. It is a retirement project goal. Not there yet... but getting closer. It will either be that or to buy a new one. There is only one brand that comes close right now for a buy new and they are made in Oregon.

In my case, it is a total rebuild, outer frame, walls, siding, roof and all. Basically build a new camper. I'm still sorting out if I use my existing frame as I have upgraded the running gear so much that it is hard to get that strong of an RV frame from the Surplus places.

The weight and balance is a concern as was mentioned. If you are into math, you can create the correct balance but you need to do every object in the camper. Again not hard, just a lot of time. In our case we actually like the floor plan we have but would make 2 adjustments, I would gain 6" more inches at the end of the bed and the bath about 6" longer and a neo angle shower. This will add 1 foot to the frame.

In my case I have access to drafting tools to layout the entire camper in a computer so I can see it all fits. Don't need the computer but it helps. Grew up on a drafting board and it worked a really long time before the computer came along.

You do end up with the quality you want and the plan you create. It will take research and I continue to learn more all the time. If you are anywhere near Elkhart IN there are RV surplus places you can build an entire camper out of no problem. You just need to hunt for and maybe compromise on some things, or buy direct from the factories if they sell that way.

Getting paneling can be a challenge or again a compromise to what you can find.

If you keep the majority of the existing floor plan you have now and just do a face lift of new wall board, new cabinets etc built in the same RV methods, your weight and balance is less affected. If hubby is an electrician by trade, trust me there is no issues with the converter or the electrical system. A camper is basically wired on the 120 VAC side like a giant rolling appliance.

Lots to think about, plan, lots of work, but can be lots of satisfaction and fun.

As far as the money part, this one is your choice. Anything we do with these campers is for enjoyment. How each of us choose to spend it, is up to those spending it. I really do not want to add up the amount of time I have in my own camper in upgrades or repairs. I would be working for pennies..... But I enjoy the work, with my hands, my head and then go camping in it .

If money is priority 1, a heads up, don't get an RV... And if your handy, it is a whole lot easier to do these kinds of things.

Good luck and take pics.

John

[Erin]

Thanks all for the thoughts.
I thought about the weights and reasons for the current layout. Looked at another layout option for the same year that was similar to our current thoughts on a unit 2 feet shorter.

I have also confirmed some of the current weights of appliances compared to their smaller versions we are looking as well as their distribution. The tongue weight I am still struggling with total understanding of so I need to do more research there.

I have the 'manual' (old school) drafting tools (my absolute love since I was 16). The mechanicals actually are the least of my concerns when moving them. As I mentioned we actually gutted our house, moved our kitchen to the other side of the house, re-ran all the plumbing and electrical lines, installed a new electrical panel and installed all gas lines to change to natural gas. We did all the work and design ourselves ( and yes it was done correctly) so I am very confident in that aspect. I have been thinking long and hard about any venting needed and there location too.

I do have concerns about the weight distribution but it sounds like I am headed in right direction with my thoughts.

I do fear my tendency to 'overbuild' since weight is a major factor. I fear building the cabinets. I know I can do it, I have the tools (we have his and her tools in our house) but since I have never built new, only rebuilt 60 yr old vintage cabinets for my laundry room (they were quarter sawn cherry that I picked up for a steal - well worth the time it took) and installed new for a customer years ago, there is always the fear on the unknown.

Unfortunately Elkhart is a 6 hour drive. I did the math to see if even one trip with gas and pet sitting would save us enough money and that would be a no. We do have a large RV store in our area that scrap RV's and sells them as parts. They have a very good reputation for not selling 'junk' or flooded out unit scraps etc so there will be some money saving there.

Thanks to all for responding.