New Roof and Hook Ladder

[apackoftwo]

Hey there Sunliners, coming to you from the Olympic National Forest in Washington


I am mulling over the idea of replacing my roof with a walkable (plywood) roof. And I am wondering with a new roof if my T-1950 could withhold a ladder like these or similar, just started looking?

Washing/ inspection/ repair is a real pain without a ladder ( I don't carry a long one with me so I borrow) Not to mention not being able to actually get on the roof

Most seem to be in the 250lb range and are 84 to 99 inches in length and the roof would add weight also. Probably would be a good idea to weight as it since I am a full time RVer. I have weighted my truck

Also what kind of insulation for the roof? Reflective? Should there be a vapor shield?

Thanks all!

[JohnB]

Hi Joan,

Some thoughts to think and work through.

Yes, weigh the camper before adding the walk on roof with the camper fully loaded the way you travel being a full timer. You have more items most likely then a weekend warrior type of camping person. The 05 T1950 had a 5,500# GVWR which helps. On a totally dry empty camper the max cargo added can be 1,685#. This does not include the battery weight, LP gas in the tanks, spare tire or any camping gear.

From my son's new roof we put on his T264SR we may be able to back into what a walk on roof might add to your camper weight. After you weigh the camper see how much is left over before reaching the 5,500#. We can then check to see if the walk will take you over the GVWR and by how much.

When weighing the camper, either unhook it from the truck so you get a total camper weight, none held by the truck, OR weigh the truck and camper hitched but with no WD bars on and then subtract from the truck only weight. Need 2 weights to get this. (Trailer hitched to truck with "no WD bars mounted" and then truck only the same day you weighed the camper hitched up with no WD bars.)

The rear ladders, a new roof can be made to hold the top of the rear ladder. They also need a bottom tie in point and a mid range tie in point on the back of the camper. From my 2004 T1950, they are going to have to go right above the top of the bumper to be able to get into the wall structure that can support the bottom. I can measure if needed, but there is only about a 1" to 1 1/2" of a 2 x 3 exposed in the wall to support the base of the ladder.

For the mid ladder support, they are going to have to add something to span the wall studs as there is nothing between them to mount to. See this very ugly pic of mine with the rear wall off. It will have to go to the left of the rear window as the hot water heater is on the right and the DOT and license plate is on the left.


Before you buy one of those RV ladders to mount on the camper, see if someone in a CG will let you test out theirs. Personally I do not like those ladders to climb up on the roof. They are very narrow, the attachment to the camper I sometimes question and doing the transition from the ladder to the roof and the roof back to the ladder is not enjoyable for me.

I do carry a multipurpose ladder with me. I can use it in step ladder fashion (6 ft) or a straight ladder (13 ft) to go up on the roof. One of these or other brands. https://www.lowes.com/pd/Werner-13-f...adder/50441824 The cost is about the same as the RV rear ladder and you do not have to mount it.

I use to store it in the truck bed. I now have a holder under the camper but while this works on my higher slide camper, it will not fit under a low riding T1950 that way. It would need to go in the truck. I have zero issues getting on the roof with this ladder or cleaning my slide or any other high side needs in the campsite. I just need a solid footing to place it on.

The roof insulation, there is already batt type fiberglass insulation up there. If you want to increase the R value, you will need to find something that will fit in the limited space that can be not a lot thicker. There is not much thickness on the wall ends of the rafters to increase the thickness. But if you can find a material with a higher R value in the same thickness, then yes it would work. Here is my T1950 with the roof off, there is only about 1 1/2" on the ends of the rafters for an insulation depth. The middle does have more.


A vapor barrier, this gets a little complex adding a ceiling vapor barrier. The moisture has to get out of the attic as the rubber roof will not allow much to go through it. 4 season campers have attic vents (not the roof vents to the living space) in the roof attic to let the moisture out that comes up through the cieling. I do not believe they use a vapor barrier. That needs more research on if that is a good thing or not on an RV roof.

Hope this helps. Nice pic from the National Forest. Thanks for sharing.

John

[apackoftwo]

EQLS8463.jpg

BSUO2649.jpg

IMG_1138.jpg

IMG_1152.jpg

TVUI0625.jpg

Few more pics. Dungeness River Trail and Port Townsend, Olympic Peninsula, WA. Gorgeous area. I should post more here but after posting on my FB page I am busy enjoying!


Hi John,

You always come through with a very through, and informative solution, much appreciated!

I will probably wait until I get back to Tucson this late Fall to weight my camper. There is a very nice truck stop there where I weighted my truck and is perfect for weighting the camper alone and hitched to the truck.

I like the idea of buying a ladder like you suggested because the one you linked to is only 32lbs as opposed to the 250lb of added weight of a hook ladder.

The pictures you posted are great as they show exactly how much room for insulation. I was hoping if I am going to incur the cost of a new roof to increase the R factor. I am going to do some research to see if there any new products that would fit the space but have better R value.

Being a 2005 the roof is now 12 years old. I don't know the lifespan of a roof but It seems that it is getting close. The last time I asked I was quoted $3,000. It's costly. But its cheaper than buying a new one and once done I would have a new roof that is good for another 15 years and is walk able, making cleaning and repair so much easier

I will be back in Michigan Spring of 2018 until Fall so that is when I will be seriously looking to have it done soooooo if you want an extra project and some glad money I would be happy to make the trip down!!

Originally Posted by JohnB

Hi Joan,

Some thoughts to think and work through.

Yes, weigh the camper before adding the walk on roof with the camper fully loaded the way you travel being a full timer. You have more items most likely then a weekend warrior type of camping person. The 05 T1950 had a 5,500# GVWR which helps. On a totally dry empty camper the max cargo added can be 1,685#. This does not include the battery weight, LP gas in the tanks, spare tire or any camping gear.

From my son's new roof we put on his T264SR we may be able to back into what a walk on roof might add to your camper weight. After you weigh the camper see how much is left over before reaching the 5,500#. We can then check to see if the walk will take you over the GVWR and by how much.

When weighing the camper, either unhook it from the truck so you get a total camper weight, none held by the truck, OR weigh the truck and camper hitched but with no WD bars on and then subtract from the truck only weight. Need 2 weights to get this. (Trailer hitched to truck with "no WD bars mounted" and then truck only the same day you weighed the camper hitched up with no WD bars.)

The rear ladders, a new roof can be made to hold the top of the rear ladder. They also need a bottom tie in point and a mid range tie in point on the back of the camper. From my 2004 T1950, they are going to have to go right above the top of the bumper to be able to get into the wall structure that can support the bottom. I can measure if needed, but there is only about a 1" to 1 1/2" of a 2 x 3 exposed in the wall to support the base of the ladder.

For the mid ladder support, they are going to have to add something to span the wall studs as there is nothing between them to mount to. See this very ugly pic of mine with the rear wall off. It will have to go to the left of the rear window as the hot water heater is on the right and the DOT and license plate is on the left.


Before you buy one of those RV ladders to mount on the camper, see if someone in a CG will let you test out theirs. Personally I do not like those ladders to climb up on the roof. They are very narrow, the attachment to the camper I sometimes question and doing the transition from the ladder to the roof and the roof back to the ladder is not enjoyable for me.

I do carry a multipurpose ladder with me. I can use it in step ladder fashion (6 ft) or a straight ladder (13 ft) to go up on the roof. One of these or other brands. https://www.lowes.com/pd/Werner-13-f...adder/50441824 The cost is about the same as the RV rear ladder and you do not have to mount it.

I use to store it in the truck bed. I now have a holder under the camper but while this works on my higher slide camper, it will not fit under a low riding T1950 that way. It would need to go in the truck. I have zero issues getting on the roof with this ladder or cleaning my slide or any other high side needs in the campsite. I just need a solid footing to place it on.

The roof insulation, there is already batt type fiberglass insulation up there. If you want to increase the R value, you will need to find something that will fit in the limited space that can be not a lot thicker. There is not much thickness on the wall ends of the rafters to increase the thickness. But if you can find a material with a higher R value in the same thickness, then yes it would work. Here is my T1950 with the roof off, there is only about 1 1/2" on the ends of the rafters for an insulation depth. The middle does have more.


A vapor barrier, this gets a little complex adding a ceiling vapor barrier. The moisture has to get out of the attic as the rubber roof will not allow much to go through it. 4 season campers have attic vents (not the roof vents to the living space) in the roof attic to let the moisture out that comes up through the cieling. I do not believe they use a vapor barrier. That needs more research on if that is a good thing or not on an RV roof.

Hope this helps. Nice pic from the National Forest. Thanks for sharing.

John

[JohnB]

Originally Posted by apackoftwo

I like the idea of buying a ladder like you suggested because the one you linked to is only 32lbs as opposed to the 250lb of added weight of a hook ladder.

Being a 2005 the roof is now 12 years old. I don't know the lifespan of a roof but It seems that it is getting close. The last time I asked I was quoted $3,000. It's costly. But its cheaper than buying a new one and once done I would have a new roof that is good for another 15 years and is walk able, making cleaning and repair so much easier

Hi Joan,

Just mentioning to clarify. The 250lb on the RV ladder is the "rated weight" or "weight capacity". Meaning it is rated to hold a 250lb person. Not that it weighs 250#. I cannot seem to find an actual physical weight of them, I would estimate, 20 to 30lbs at the most. But yes, the RV ladder is only one use and not multi use.

On your roof, are there large spots or areas that all the white surface has worn off? Take pics and post if needed. When you see that or large cracks in the rubber, that is a good indicator the roof "may" need to be coated or replaced. If it is still all white and smooth (other then small mold spots) then it may not necessarily need replacement just yet.

I do not know the history of your roof before you acquired it. And you have been camping in AZ which is a lot more sun then back here in the mid west. Have you by chance cleaned it or used any UV protectent on a routine basis?

My 2004 T310SR camper, made in Nov. 2003 has had a lot of TLC over the years with routine cleaning and 303 UV protectant added and the rubber condition is still very good. I looked at it this spring and I am not seeing the need on mine for a good while yet. But again I have not been in the AZ sun as long as yours either.

When a roof needs to be replaced it is also based on conditions and maintenance. Some go faster then the 12 years, some around the 12 years and some go much longer. It all depends.

If you have no leaks, a roof coating is also an option to replacement. There are roof coatings that can extend the roof replace by 5 years and then a re-coat can go again. This helps spread out the roof costs, but does not address a walk on roof. The walk on roof only comes with a replacement.

Just throwing out options to think through so when the time comes, you make the one the best for you.

Thanks

John

PS. Nice pics!!! Thanks for sharing.

[apackoftwo]

John,


Well duh! LOL! Why did I think the ladder would weight 250lbs? Apparently not thinking


I have tired to be religious about washing it at least twice a year with RV roof cleaner. (my camper too.) Washed the roof in New Mexico late March and I can wash it here too

I have never added 303 UV protectant which I have and use on the decals. How do you apply it?

It was completely resealed about 3 maybe going on 4 years ago and I think they did a good job.


My roof has some "bubbles" and mold spots and I don't think where are large areas where the white has rubbed off and no large cracks but I can take pictures and will post

I spoke with someone who had his roof coated and I know there are many options for coating products. Any you can suggest any?

Thanks!

Originally Posted by JohnB

Hi Joan,

Just mentioning to clarify. The 250lb on the RV ladder is the "rated weight" or "weight capacity". Meaning it is rated to hold a 250lb person. Not that it weighs 250#. I cannot seem to find an actual physical weight of them, I would estimate, 20 to 30lbs at the most. But yes, the RV ladder is only one use and not multi use.

On your roof, are there large spots or areas that all the white surface has worn off? Take pics and post if needed. When you see that or large cracks in the rubber, that is a good indicator the roof "may" need to be coated or replaced. If it is still all white and smooth (other then small mold spots) then it may not necessarily need replacement just yet.

I do not know the history of your roof before you acquired it. And you have been camping in AZ which is a lot more sun then back here in the mid west. Have you by chance cleaned it or used any UV protectent on a routine basis?

My 2004 T310SR camper, made in Nov. 2003 has had a lot of TLC over the years with routine cleaning and 303 UV protectant added and the rubber condition is still very good. I looked at it this spring and I am not seeing the need on mine for a good while yet. But again I have not been in the AZ sun as long as yours either.

When a roof needs to be replaced it is also based on conditions and maintenance. Some go faster then the 12 years, some around the 12 years and some go much longer. It all depends.

If you have no leaks, a roof coating is also an option to replacement. There are roof coatings that can extend the roof replace by 5 years and then a re-coat can go again. This helps spread out the roof costs, but does not address a walk on roof. The walk on roof only comes with a replacement.

Just throwing out options to think through so when the time comes, you make the one the best for you.

Thanks

John

PS. Nice pics!!! Thanks for sharing.

[JohnB]

Originally Posted by apackoftwo

John,

I have tired to be religious about washing it at least twice a year with RV roof cleaner. (my camper too.) Washed the roof in New Mexico late March and I can wash it here too

I have never added 303 UV protectant which I have and use on the decals. How do you apply it?

It was completely resealed about 3 maybe going on 4 years ago and I think they did a good job.

My roof has some "bubbles" and mold spots and I don't think where are large areas where the white has rubbed off and no large cracks but I can take pictures and will post

I spoke with someone who had his roof coated and I know there are many options for coating products. Any you can suggest any?

For the 303 on the roof, I apply it after cleaning the roof and letting it dry. This I use a squirt bottle with 303 in it. Using a stream spray, I squirt it out over the roof area I'm doing. Which is about half way across and about 5 to 6 feet long.

Then I use a car wax applicator I bought to spread it. It looks like a mod head on a pole. See here






I can reach from the side of the camper with this and spread the 303 all over. Including all plastic on the roof and all the Dicor sealant. You can make something like this too with an old towel on pole. When you spread it, you can see a sheen of the 303 and places you missed as there is no sheen.

When you stated a re-seal 3 or 4 years back, I'm assuming you mean the roof caulking? Yes/no?. I saw your roof on Spring M & G that time which is just before you went full timing. Yes, they did a good job. That caulking needs to be looks at and touched up frequently. At least 2 times a year, better is 4 times a year. You are looking for tiny splits or cracks. And then you clean it and apply new Dicor. when the caulk reaches 3 to 4 years old, these tiny splits which grow in size start showing up more and more frequent.

See this post for more on this. http://www.sunlineclub.com/forums/f7...1-a-11508.html

The coatings, I have been collecting a lot of info on them over the years but I myself have never used them. So all I can offer at this time is some of the better info I found. Many roof places seem to sell a roof paint so to speak and then this product which is liquid rubber. I feel the liquid rubber is better then the paint for lasting.

This one comes up often https://www.epdmcoatings.com/rv-roof-repair.php

Proguard is the manufacture https://proguardcoatings.com/liquid-rubber/

I have a very good friend who just used the Proguard product. See here Good Sam Club Open Roads Forum: Painting roof What to use?

I would say a call to ProGurad themselves would be in order to make sure which is the right product of theirs and which primer should be used.

There is another product/company I found that they will apply their product and guarantee the product for a good long time. They are down south but they may have other dealers now using it too. I can't find that link right now, I'll look some more.

Thanks

John

[apackoftwo]

Thanks John.

I will do the 303 on the roof when I can and research the pro guard!

First time loading up a video...Dungenees River on the trail

Originally Posted by JohnB

For the 303 on the roof, I apply it after cleaning the roof and letting it dry. This I use a squirt bottle with 303 in it. Using a stream spray, I squirt it out over the roof area I'm doing. Which is about half way across and about 5 to 6 feet long.

Then I use a car wax applicator I bought to spread it. It looks like a mod head on a pole. See here






I can reach from the side of the camper with this and spread the 303 all over. Including all plastic on the roof and all the Dicor sealant. You can make something like this too with an old towel on pole. When you spread it, you can see a sheen of the 303 and places you missed as there is no sheen.

When you stated a re-seal 3 or 4 years back, I'm assuming you mean the roof caulking? Yes/no?. I saw your roof on Spring M & G that time which is just before you went full timing. Yes, they did a good job. That caulking needs to be looks at and touched up frequently. At least 2 times a year, better is 4 times a year. You are looking for tiny splits or cracks. And then you clean it and apply new Dicor. when the caulk reaches 3 to 4 years old, these tiny splits which grow in size start showing up more and more frequent.

See this post for more on this. http://www.sunlineclub.com/forums/f7...1-a-11508.html

The coatings, I have been collecting a lot of info on them over the years but I myself have never used them. So all I can offer at this time is some of the better info I found. Many roof places seem to sell a roof paint so to speak and then this product which is liquid rubber. I feel the liquid rubber is better then the paint for lasting.

This one comes up often https://www.epdmcoatings.com/rv-roof-repair.php

Proguard is the manufacture https://proguardcoatings.com/liquid-rubber/

I have a very good friend who just used the Proguard product. See here Good Sam Club Open Roads Forum: Painting roof What to use?

I would say a call to ProGurad themselves would be in order to make sure which is the right product of theirs and which primer should be used.

There is another product/company I found that they will apply their product and guarantee the product for a good long time. They are down south but they may have other dealers now using it too. I can't find that link right now, I'll look some more.

Thanks

John

[JohnB]

Wow, that is a fast flowing river...

Beauty back drop in the forest!

Thanks for sharing.

John