LED Bulbs

Honda03842 · 07-12-2009, 04:22 PM

We plan to boondock more this year, particularly in Labrador. One of the primary energy drains are the lights.

A single incandescent bulb can draw 2 amps, consuming 24 watts an hour producing 100 or so Lumens. A single super bright LED of the same brightness draws 3 watts or 0.25 amps.

As a result we are thinking of replacing some of the bulbs with Superbright LEDs, focusing on the most used locations, over the bed and over the kitchen table. Though they are expensive there is no need to replace them all, they last forever, while a well used fixture may require replacement of the lamp three times a year. The LED lamps cost between $12 and $21.

Note there are many white LED's, some much cheaper but only the superbright, square LEDs produce light similar to an RV's incandescent. I should have mine in a week and will report on them

We have found two sources for these lights.

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.13433
$12.43

http://www.superbrightleds.com/cgi-b...?product=OTHER
$21.95

Norm

Steve Collins · 07-12-2009, 04:53 PM

Norm,

Also checkout:

http://autolumination.com/

http://www.v-leds.com/

and there are beginning to be some good deals on eBay, depending on which base you need for your trailer.

My '99 uses all 921's (which is the T-10 base) in both the indoors lighting fixtures and on three illumination fixtures on the outside of the trailer. There are a number of good choices available now in that size bulb/base.

I'm also going to replace the exterior lights, both markers and turn signals, when the old budget permits.

Viking · 07-12-2009, 07:24 PM

Norm and Steve,
I know LED technology is constantly improving, but last time I looked at the issue of LED v.s. CFL, the CFL were still more efficient overall.
The advantage of LED is that it is more directional, so it puts the light where you need it.
Roar

Honda03842 · 07-12-2009, 07:45 PM

Roar,

CFL's are marginally more efficient than LED's however CFLs don't fit into a trailer's 12 volt bulb sockets and require AC.

In the long term I suspect LEDs will win the battle primarily on environmental (mercury in CFLS) and manufacturing issues (flexibility and size).

Norm

Viking · 07-12-2009, 08:22 PM

Norm,
CFL marginally more efficient today, and probably marginally less efficient tomorrow, and add to that the life expectancy of LED's, and I am sure you are on the right track.
Have a great trip, and I hope for more pictures in your reports.
Roar

Steve Collins · 07-13-2009, 06:20 AM

Norm,

Here is another source that may be of interest:

http://www.oznium.com/led-dome

They only offer the square dome light panels with adapters for the various bases. They don't carry LED's in standard bulb configurations like 194, 921, 1156, 1157, etc. like some of the other vendors do, but still good prices on two of their offerings.

Honda03842 · 07-13-2009, 08:52 AM

I went to the Oznium site and they fail to mention the number of Lumens each LED array produces. To equal an RV bulb you need around 100 Lumenns.

I've submitted a question to them about Lumen output.

Norm

Honda03842 · 07-13-2009, 02:29 PM

Oznium responded to my question about the Lumen output of their bulbs.

They do not rate the Lumen output.

Norm

**JohnB** · 07-13-2009, 09:13 PM

Hi Guys

This post is interesting and something more now I'm researching because of it....

The 921 bulb drop in's they seem to be LED end focused. How does the light shine down towards the floor instead of across the ceiling?

LED's are generally straight out the end focused with light.

How do you get around this or does it matter?

Thanks

John

Steve Collins · 07-14-2009, 06:06 AM

John,

A lot of the LED's in automotive bulb sizes are "end only" as you say.

But there are "tower" LED bulbs available that radiate light out the sides as well as the end. They look like this:

Norm is looking at LED's that are essentially a square circuit board with a bunch of LED's mounted on it. It has a pigtail that ends in the right plug to fit in the bulb socket. Basically you mount the board in the light fixture with some double side sticky material and plug it in.

There are also 90 degree angled bulbs that could be used in places like the 1157 bulbs in the turn signal fixtures on our TT's. While the pic shows only narrow angle viewing of 35 degrees, there are other viewing angle bulbs available from other sources:

There's a wide variety of viewing angle and brightness out there, and not all of it is good. There are a lot of "cheapies" that are pretty much useless. But there are some good ones too.

I put a pair of red 1157 LED's in some auxilary turn signal fixtures on my truck. They're as bright as an incandescent, but don't "fill" the lens in the same way. At any distance, they are awesome to the eye. I bought them over the counter at AutoZone, and I probably won't get any more of them as they were the only choice that they carry. I see some stuff online that will work much better in other applications.

Look over the automotive bulb section of www.superbrightleds.com and you will get a more detailed look at all of this.

Steve Collins · 07-14-2009, 07:20 AM

One other bulb might be of real interest here for the indoor lights on our Sunlines. The one pictured has the T-10 base which is the same as the 921's, and has the right amount of lumens plus it is available in both cool white and warm white:

The beam pattern is 120 degrees and they're 14.95 each. Current draw is 205 mA in Cool White and 195 mA for Warm White. The circuitry is exposed on the back of the board so I don't think this particular lamp is good for exterior use. Full specs at: http://www.superbrightleds.com/specs/WLED-xHP10-D.htm

Honda03842 · 07-14-2009, 08:23 AM

I ordered a couple similar to these but with the 1157 base used in the older trailers.

Norm

**JohnB** · 07-14-2009, 10:36 AM

Steve and Norm

OK the “light bulb” turned on…LOL

Steve, super thanks for the pic show and tell. Now I got it.

Now that I see how this works, H’mm now I have to really investigate this more! The way the ceiling lights are in our camper I can do like Norm says, pick select ones to upgrade to LED as the first wave.

Then the rest I can change out the regular incandescent bulbs in the other locations to the lower wattage incandescent as an intern step to help offset the cost. If we continue to camp on the battery, well more upgrades will come in time.

We also have the spot lights. 2 in the bed room and 2 in the living area. They down right get hot... DW reads in bed a lot and just because we are on battery power the book still must go on. I don’t want to be saying, Honey, no reading in bed because it drains the battery to much… that won’t go over so I need a technology upgrade in that location for sure…

OK there is Cool white and Warm white? Any descriptive words on the difference?

Thanks Again!!

Joh

MACK C-85 · 07-14-2009, 10:41 AM

http://www.superbrightleds.com/carbulb-notes.htm

Quote:

What is the difference between Warm White and Cool White?
Warm white and cool white have two different correlated color temperatures which are measured in Kelvin. Warm white (2500K~4000K) resembles incandescent light bulbs, cool white (5000K~8000k) resembles fluorescent light bulbs.

Honda03842 · 07-14-2009, 10:42 AM

I bought Cool White from Superbright because they put out more Lumens then Warm White. They are in the way to me and I will post a test when they come. However people are color sensitive.

I met a guy with an Oliver, a rather nice egg shaped, all fiberglas trailer. He had LEDs every where except over the stove where he had incandescent because he was use to how his food looked under incandascent.

I should know more by the end of the week.

What size bulbs are in your spots?

Norm

mbart5fan · 07-14-2009, 01:06 PM

John,

As we camp primarily at non electric sites and are both avid readers we use this for reading in bed in lieu of the reading lights.

http://www.mightybright.com/Book_Lig...uctDetail.html

We've also started using them while reading around the fireplace at night to avoid the annoying hiss and brightness of a propane lantern.

Between this thread and Norm's homemade solar panel, like you, I see more modifications coming up.

Mike

Lode · 07-15-2009, 08:06 AM

Mike... brilliant minds must think a like.

I'd pm'd John the same link yesterday around lunch time reccommending a nice gift for his wife.

My wife has used the Extra Flex 2-LED model for about a year and she loves it. It gets used everyday whether we're camping or at home. I also bought the AC power plug with it for use at home but 3 AAA batteries last for a long time when we're boondocking.

Here's their full selection...
http://www.mightybright.com/Book_Lig...oductList.html

Take care,
Lode

Steve Collins · 07-15-2009, 03:47 PM

One other option is the "StickNClick" LED lights that are available almost everywhere. I have seen them in CVS, Target, Wal-Mart, Rite-Aid, grocery stores, etc. They come in a pack of 3 for $9.99. There is just one LED but it is fairly bright, although I don't really think it's great for reading. The base has sticky stuff so you can put them anywhere. (If you prefer, pick up some of the 3M Command adhesive packs and use that instead of what comes with them. Much easier to remove later on.) The fixture is removeable from the base with a simple twist so you can also use it as a regular flashlight. We've gotten two years of out one set of AAA batteries in them. We put one in the bathroom for those late night visits and one over the swivel rocker. The third is going over the bed next to the reading lights.

**JohnB** · 07-15-2009, 09:34 PM

Thanks guys for all the help. Now have many options

I do have some of those stick on puck lights similar to what Steve is showing. However mine have 5 LEDS in them, the housing pivots and have low, medium and high power.

http://www.lampsplus.com/products/Ri...ts__28005.html

I can not find the actual mfr web site for Rite Lite to get what other products they make. The ones I bought where at Walmart but I see them now all over for a lot less then what is on that web site I linked you too.

I have one in my slide out cargo hole. The other 2 are not yet placed. They are hard to read by though.

John

Honda03842 · 07-16-2009, 07:30 PM

I received my bulbs from SuperBrightLEDs.com today.

I performed the following test tonight.

LED - Cool White 1156-PCB-xWHP9 White LED Lamp

Incandescent - Standard 1156 Incandescent

My conclusion was the Incandescent was brighter and the color yellower, though not appreciably brighter.

Another thing to recognize is that Incandescents brightness varies dramatically with voltage while LEDs hardly change with voltage. Definitely a concern when boondocking.

I think I'll buy a Warm White version to check the difference.

Norm