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Old 11-14-2014, 09:32 PM   #1
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Question Electric Otlet Quit Working

Only the front outlet all the sudden quit working. It does not have a reset.

I checked the usual stuff, fuse box breaker and fuse, out side breaker and everything was ok.

On fuse panel box, the last small light is lit, its said "BT. Check"

I have no idea what that means?

However I am thinking that its the outlet itself. I haven't taken it out to look at it, will do that tomorrow.

I do think I probably have to much on it. I use a heavy duty power strip but I have been using my little Franklin stove electric heater quite a bit lately (polar vortex got Texas) plus I had a small LED lamp and my Macbook computer.

I don't have a voltage checker, was on my list *sigh*

Soooo I am wondering what does "BT. Check" mean?

Is that MORE than just replacing the electric outlet?
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Old 11-14-2014, 10:03 PM   #2
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Ok it was the GFCI in the kitchen was tripped. Outlet is working now

However, this has to be a reason it tripped? I have had my diesel truck plugged in to the outside outlets for a few nights now and I wonder if the moisture from a frost then warming up would be enough to cause this problem? Never have plugged my truck in before
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Old 11-14-2014, 10:22 PM   #3
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Oh No! It just tripped again!

I reset it again but now it doesn't work

My truck is plugged in...so I could have.....A leak again somewhere??!!

I really don't know what to do next??



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Originally Posted by apackoftwo View Post
Ok it was the GFCI in the kitchen was tripped. Outlet is working now

However, this has to be a reason it tripped? I have had my diesel truck plugged in to the outside outlets for a few nights now and I wonder if the moisture from a frost then warming up would be enough to cause this problem? Never have plugged my truck in before
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Old 11-14-2014, 11:38 PM   #4
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Joan,

In your 2005, I "think" you have the American Enterprise CS6000XL power converter.

I'm assuming this is the BT check light you mean


I do not have the manual for that model converter any more, I "think" it might be "Battery Check". But I do not know why it is being tripped. The manual if you have one might say.

To the GFI tripping, your heater may be overloading the circuit as something else may be on the circuit as well. Check the breaker box as it may have tripped the breaker. If you tripped the breaker, odds are high you are overloading that circuit.

Post a pic of your power converter that looks like this. The galley outlet (appliance) which is sometimes a stand alone outlet as toasters and other things of high power are plugged in there. If yours is wired that way, that outlet would be better choice for the heater. The "General purpose" circuit has a lot on it around the camper


Sunline Coach Owner's Club - Sunline Owner's Files - Sunline Solaris T-2499 Wiring Diagram

Your truck being plugged in, if you mean the 7 wire cable, that is 12 volt DC power and may be the reason the BT check light might be on. Some GM trucks have the battery charge pin in the 7 wire plug on the back of the truck live to the battery so the power converter may be trying to charge the truck battery and the camper battery. This is a long shot, but unplug the truck and see if that BT light goes out.

The 120 VAC wall outlet is not tied to the 12 volt DC system other then the power converter may be trying to charge both the camper and the truck battery, draining more power on the converter and then the heater if it is on that same circuit could trip the GFI or the breaker. Again I do not know what circuit is which in your floor plan. The 12 volt DC and the 120 volt AC are not connected and under normal conditions do not interfere with each other other than the power converter.

When I run an electric heater in the camper I either bring in a separate 12 gauge power cord just for the heater or plug it into the appliance outlet as on mine I know that outlet is a dedicated circuit. A 1,500 watt heater can be a lot in a camper pending what else is plugged in on that same circuit

Hope this helps and good luck

John

PS. It is really cold up here tonight. It is 25F out now...
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Old 11-15-2014, 10:08 AM   #5
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I checked my manual. Not one thing about the converter. It is an American. But to clarify the ONLY outlet not working is the one located in the front of the camper.

I did use a power strip however the heater, LED lamp and Macbook were all plugged into it. The LED bulb is a 40 watt rated and the Macbook will "sleep" However, a dedicated power cord is a good idea

When I reset the GFCI located in the kitchen, power was restored momentarily then when out again. I have since reset it and nothing.

Is the GFCI burned out? The outlet itself works however on my other GFCI outlet in the bathroom, the reset button is pushed in. In the kitchen it isn't. Both the test and reset are the same

I unplugged the truck but it made no difference.

The battery is a brand new marine

One thing I now remember is that the radio also located in the front quite working. Sometimes it will play a CD, sometimes not. None of the little lights, "FM", "CD" "AUX" work. It is on however, displays time and I can turn it on and off. Don't know if this has anything to do with it or how the radio is wired just mentioned it because it located in the front too

BUT, could it be that the outlet itself just needs replacing?
I could run into to town to see if they have a meter at the tiny hardware but closest Home Depot is about 20-25 miles away
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Old 11-15-2014, 10:48 AM   #6
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I just reset the GFCI located in the kitchen and the outlet worked for a minute then is out again, it is working, then not working,

The only thing I had plugged in was my string of LED Flamingo lights so I would know if the plug was working

Bad GFCI?

BTW I do have a Progressive Surge Guard plugged in and it show nothing usual there
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Old 11-15-2014, 04:11 PM   #7
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GFI's do go bad. Some older GFI's have issues with resistive loads (like diesel truck heaters) At least the GFI is easy to replace unlike some of the outlets. Any big box store will have one they are 15 amp GFI's just like the ones for the house it's not a special one for an RV. If it can not be reset it is one of two things, it has no power or it is toes up.
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:25 PM   #8
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Well it's true, nothing lasts forever. I am going to Home Depot tomorrow
It's about 25 miles from where I am at in Hill Country

So you say the older ones have issues with resistive loads
Does that mean the new one I buy won't have that problem?

What do I do if I need to plug in my diesel on a freezing night?
Could I use the 20 amp plug on the camp electric pole?

Thanks for the reply!


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Originally Posted by mainah View Post
GFI's do go bad. Some older GFI's have issues with resistive loads (like diesel truck heaters) At least the GFI is easy to replace unlike some of the outlets. Any big box store will have one they are 15 amp GFI's just like the ones for the house it's not a special one for an RV. If it can not be reset it is one of two things, it has no power or it is toes up.
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Old 11-15-2014, 08:29 PM   #9
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It's that darn polar vortex!! However, it seems like it's moving out mid week for everyone thank goodness. They had a record low here for November the other night!

Thanks for the reply!!


Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnB View Post
Joan,

In your 2005, I "think" you have the American Enterprise CS6000XL power converter.

I'm assuming this is the BT check light you mean


I do not have the manual for that model converter any more, I "think" it might be "Battery Check". But I do not know why it is being tripped. The manual if you have one might say.

To the GFI tripping, your heater may be overloading the circuit as something else may be on the circuit as well. Check the breaker box as it may have tripped the breaker. If you tripped the breaker, odds are high you are overloading that circuit.

Post a pic of your power converter that looks like this. The galley outlet (appliance) which is sometimes a stand alone outlet as toasters and other things of high power are plugged in there. If yours is wired that way, that outlet would be better choice for the heater. The "General purpose" circuit has a lot on it around the camper


Sunline Coach Owner's Club - Sunline Owner's Files - Sunline Solaris T-2499 Wiring Diagram

Your truck being plugged in, if you mean the 7 wire cable, that is 12 volt DC power and may be the reason the BT check light might be on. Some GM trucks have the battery charge pin in the 7 wire plug on the back of the truck live to the battery so the power converter may be trying to charge the truck battery and the camper battery. This is a long shot, but unplug the truck and see if that BT light goes out.

The 120 VAC wall outlet is not tied to the 12 volt DC system other then the power converter may be trying to charge both the camper and the truck battery, draining more power on the converter and then the heater if it is on that same circuit could trip the GFI or the breaker. Again I do not know what circuit is which in your floor plan. The 12 volt DC and the 120 volt AC are not connected and under normal conditions do not interfere with each other other than the power converter.

When I run an electric heater in the camper I either bring in a separate 12 gauge power cord just for the heater or plug it into the appliance outlet as on mine I know that outlet is a dedicated circuit. A 1,500 watt heater can be a lot in a camper pending what else is plugged in on that same circuit

Hope this helps and good luck

John

PS. It is really cold up here tonight. It is 25F out now...
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Old 11-15-2014, 09:27 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apackoftwo View Post
I just reset the GFCI located in the kitchen and the outlet worked for a minute then is out again, it is working, then not working,

The only thing I had plugged in was my string of LED Flamingo lights so I would know if the plug was working

Bad GFCI?

BTW I do have a Progressive Surge Guard plugged in and it show nothing usual there
The GFI may be bad.

Do you know which breaker runs that outlet? Is it the "Appliance" breaker or the "General Purpose" breaker? While you may have only plugged in certain things there are other things in the camper tied to the General Purpose breaker, the fridge electric element, the power converter and then possibly all of the outlets, inside and out. If you are running the fridge on electric, the power converter is working and then a 1,500 watt electric heater is on high, that could be a problem.

However you keep saying the GFI in the kitchen area and assuming this is near the sink/stove they may wired your floor plan different and that wall outlet is on the Appliance circuit. Do not know but you can find this out by flipping the breaker off and see if the pink flamingo light goes off with which breaker.

It may be if that GFI is powering the wall outlet, the heater higher load pushed it into going bad faster.

Is there a helper person in the CG who is electrically friendly? They can replace the GFI for you?

On the diesel truck heater, I would plug that in direct to the power post and not put on the camper outlets. Yes you need a 14 awg or a 12 awg extension cord with that. That can be another 1,000 to 1,200 watts. By chance was that truck heater plugged in to the camper when this all started?

And are you plugging the truck heater in all night long or only a hour or so before you need to start it? I'm assuming you have a block heater or a heater in the radiator hose.

I just saw this
Quote:
I have had my diesel truck plugged in to the outside outlets for a few nights now and I wonder if the moisture from a frost then warming up would be enough to cause this problem? Never have plugged my truck in before
I had thought you meant the 7 wire cable between the truck and camper. It now sounds like a engine block heater is plugged into the camper. That can be a problem.

I also know that certain GFI's and engine block heaters do not get along.

Right now your GFI may be bad caused by the truck and camper inside electric heater running on the circuit. If this is the case, fix the GFI and do not put the truck on the camper.

Confirm back more on this truck heater how you are using it.
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Old 11-15-2014, 09:36 PM   #11
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I have a wild thought on this light



Since it is green, it may be indicting the battery is fully charged. It might be a multi color LED can change to yellow and red pending the battery charge. You mentioned you had a new battery. It should be good.

If you notice in my pic of my T2499, it was green there too, just not as bright as yours. Really need a manual on the converter or another member with a late made 2004 or 2005 camper with the same power converter and maybe they had the converter manual. I had one but I let it go with the T2499. Viking (screen name) has it now.
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Old 11-15-2014, 09:44 PM   #12
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Yes I plugged my Diesel engine block heater into the outside outlets ALL night as it was freezing temps at night

I have not looked yet to see if there is an electrical circuit file here
to know how the outlets are wired however the only outlet not working
is the outlet in the front and that is the one I have the heater plugged into plus the LED lamp and MacBook

There is a camp host but I am not sure he will help
I was thinking of going it myself. Turn off the power and take a picture
of how the old one is wired so I would know how to wire the new one

I think you are right on the BT. Check light!
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Old 11-16-2014, 05:26 AM   #13
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I also have a diesel and never plug it in. Just turn the key and wait for the igniter lite to go out. Unless your in sub zero temperatures or want a pre warmed truck plugging in not necessary.
If you want to plug in your truck buy a 12 Gauge extension cord and plug into pedestal bypassing camper.
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Old 11-16-2014, 09:32 AM   #14
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If it is an outside outlet it is protected by a GFI. The new GFI's should not be a problem with heaters. Yes there is no reason that you can't plug into a camp ground outlet for your truck heater..
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Old 11-16-2014, 10:20 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apackoftwo View Post
Yes I plugged my Diesel engine block heater into the outside outlets ALL night as it was freezing temps at night
Hi Joan,

What is your thinking on the need to plug the truck heater in all night long, even in freezing temps? Depending on the need, this may not be needed. Emergency vehicles stored outside, may be plugged in all the time becasue of need to start at moments notice.

If you are concerned the engine will freeze and break something, there is a miss understanding here. Unless you have something really special, and I suspect not, engine block heaters or radiators hose heaters or even crank case oil heaters are intended to help warm up the engine/oil to help cold weather starting of the truck "when" you go to start the truck. Not to protect from freezing.

I have a block heater in my diesel tractor. This looks like a heating element in an electric hot water heater. When it is plugged in, the element heats the water in the engine block and by thermal expansion/siphon it slowly moves water around. If it is sub zero or even 25 deg F I go out about 30 minutes to an hour before starting and plug it in. Then come out, turn the start key until the air intake glow plug warms up a little (15 to 30 seconds) and the engine fires right off with no strain.

My son has a gas tractor and he has the heater hose water heater, same concept, just easier to install in his case and it works well to help start engines in really cold weather.

All these engine heaters are made for easier starting in very cold weather and not to protect from freezing.

The antifreeze in the truck radiator keeps the engine coolant from freezing.

If you are not going out needing the truck, there is no real need to plug it in. If you can go out an hour before leaving and it is below freezing, then you can plug it in before hand.

Does this help explain the engine heater and needs?
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Old 11-16-2014, 10:49 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apackoftwo View Post

I have not looked yet to see if there is an electrical circuit file here
to know how the outlets are wired however the only outlet not working
is the outlet in the front and that is the one I have the heater plugged into plus the LED lamp and MacBook

There is a camp host but I am not sure he will help
I was thinking of going it myself. Turn off the power and take a picture
of how the old one is wired so I would know how to wire the new one
There is only 1 camping wiring diag as of today on the forum. It is from my prior 2004, T2499. I was able to get it when Sunline was still in business. So do not spend a lot of time looking.

And maybe my point about what else is on the circuit is not clear as you say,

Quote:
the only outlet not working
is the outlet in the front and that is the one I have the heater plugged into plus the LED lamp and MacBook
Did we understand this correct, the GFI in the kitchen is being flaky right now and when you reset it, the front wall plug starts working? If so, then there is at least 2 outlets on the same circuit that starts back in the power converter with the the same circuit breaker. Depending if this is the "Appliance" or the "General Purpose" circuit as labeled in the power converter, many other things can be on the same circuit and you not realize it.

While the front wall outlet may not be working, that outlet can be on the same circuit as other electrical loads in the camper and they all run through that GFI. The outside wall outlet, (that you had the truck plugged into), the electric element for the fridge, other inside wall outlets.

The only way to sort this out "once" you get the GFI fixed, is to get all the outlets working again at least on a lamp or something small in load. Go test every outlet inside and outside the camper. When they all work, then flip off the appliance breaker in the power converter. And you need to turn off the battery with the disconnect switch so you can figure out what circuit the power converter is on. Turn on a cieling light anywhere in the camper. It if does not work with the battery off, then the power converter is on this circuit. Now go back around and plug that test light in again and see which outlets do and do not work. The ones that do not work are all on the the same appliance breaker. To figure out the fridge, you have to pull the white plastic cover off outside and unplug the electric heater and put the test light in that outlet. Once this is all figured out, turn the breaker back on.

Do the same thing for the general purpose breaker. More than likely all the other outlets are on this breaker. The fridge, power converter are "normally" on the general purpose circuit. But in your camper, this may not be the case. Now you know which breaker feeds which outlet. And you need to not plug more then 1 heat producing device into that circuit. Only 1 toaster, only 1 coffee pot, only 1 heater, only 1 curling iron, only 1 hair dryer, only 1 crock pot etc. That is the easy thing to remember as short of this, you need to start adding up watts of power to figure this out.

Hopefully replacing the GFI will get the camper back up and going.

Heads up on the GFI for who ever does this. There is a load side and a line side on the wires and terminals. The most common mistake made on a GFI is getting these mixed up. While most times folks get the white wires and black wires on the correct side, they mix up the line and load wires. Before any wire is unhooked, figure out which wire is on the line terminals and which is the load wire and label the wires. On both the wires and the back of the receptacle. An electrician knows all this and how to sort it out when it gets mixed up.

If after getting the GFI changed and you are sure other outlets that are down stream of the GFI work, (so we know the new GFI is wired right) and the front wall outlet still does not work, report back.

Hope this helps

John
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Old 11-17-2014, 07:03 AM   #17
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No, its the GFI in the kitchen and when I reset it the front outlet came on, then went out about 6-7 times but now has quit working entirely

There is a GFI in the bathroom but that one is ok

And the only outlet not working is in the front, the kitchen, bathroom and the outside ones are all working.

There has also been moisture here, from the freezing at night and warming during the day and now rain the past two days, so since they are designed to shut off because of moisture..Could be a combination of both things, to many items plugged in combined with moisture and it died. Or it was just its time.

So when it dries out a bit here I will check for moisture in the outside plug, refrigerator plug etc before I install the new GFI and then I will report back!

About my diesel, I thought I had to plug it in when it got freezing. Probably because I stored it in my garage in the Winter and would plug it in when it was freezing for long periods of time. Just thought I was supposed to. However, I will plug into the camp post before I use it. Although this cold snap is supposed to break here Tues. No more freezing temps at night! Night time temps after Tues. 40-50's this week.

Thank You! It's all a learning experience!

Quote:
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There is only 1 camping wiring diag as of today on the forum. It is from my prior 2004, T2499. I was able to get it when Sunline was still in business. So do not spend a lot of time looking.

And maybe my point about what else is on the circuit is not clear as you say,

Did we understand this correct, the GFI in the kitchen is being flaky right now and when you reset it, the front wall plug starts working? If so, then there is at least 2 outlets on the same circuit that starts back in the power converter with the the same circuit breaker. Depending if this is the "Appliance" or the "General Purpose" circuit as labeled in the power converter, many other things can be on the same circuit and you not realize it.

While the front wall outlet may not be working, that outlet can be on the same circuit as other electrical loads in the camper and they all run through that GFI. The outside wall outlet, (that you had the truck plugged into), the electric element for the fridge, other inside wall outlets.

The only way to sort this out "once" you get the GFI fixed, is to get all the outlets working again at least on a lamp or something small in load. Go test every outlet inside and outside the camper. When they all work, then flip off the appliance breaker in the power converter. And you need to turn off the battery with the disconnect switch so you can figure out what circuit the power converter is on. Turn on a cieling light anywhere in the camper. It if does not work with the battery off, then the power converter is on this circuit. Now go back around and plug that test light in again and see which outlets do and do not work. The ones that do not work are all on the the same appliance breaker. To figure out the fridge, you have to pull the white plastic cover off outside and unplug the electric heater and put the test light in that outlet. Once this is all figured out, turn the breaker back on.

Do the same thing for the general purpose breaker. More than likely all the other outlets are on this breaker. The fridge, power converter are "normally" on the general purpose circuit. But in your camper, this may not be the case. Now you know which breaker feeds which outlet. And you need to not plug more then 1 heat producing device into that circuit. Only 1 toaster, only 1 coffee pot, only 1 heater, only 1 curling iron, only 1 hair dryer, only 1 crock pot etc. That is the easy thing to remember as short of this, you need to start adding up watts of power to figure this out.

Hopefully replacing the GFI will get the camper back up and going.

Heads up on the GFI for who ever does this. There is a load side and a line side on the wires and terminals. The most common mistake made on a GFI is getting these mixed up. While most times folks get the white wires and black wires on the correct side, they mix up the line and load wires. Before any wire is unhooked, figure out which wire is on the line terminals and which is the load wire and label the wires. On both the wires and the back of the receptacle. An electrician knows all this and how to sort it out when it gets mixed up.

If after getting the GFI changed and you are sure other outlets that are down stream of the GFI work, (so we know the new GFI is wired right) and the front wall outlet still does not work, report back.

Hope this helps

John
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Old 11-17-2014, 07:08 AM   #18
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I do use a 12 gauge. Its about 25-30ft. I also have a smaller one about 3-4ft

I have a big black tool chest in my truck. My friend called it a "coffin" LOL!

Thank You! It's all a learning experience!



Quote:
Originally Posted by jim44646 View Post
I also have a diesel and never plug it in. Just turn the key and wait for the igniter lite to go out. Unless your in sub zero temperatures or want a pre warmed truck plugging in not necessary.
If you want to plug in your truck buy a 12 Gauge extension cord and plug into pedestal bypassing camper.
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Old 11-17-2014, 07:13 AM   #19
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Great!

Thank you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mainah View Post
If it is an outside outlet it is protected by a GFI. The new GFI's should not be a problem with heaters. Yes there is no reason that you can't plug into a camp ground outlet for your truck heater..
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Old 11-20-2014, 03:37 PM   #20
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Unhappy

I installed a new GFI. Green light is on but it doesn't work

Not only that BUT now the kitchen outlet doesn't work either!

Maybe I got the the the line and load wires mixed up?

Now I am down to two outlets that work, bath, bedroom (plus the outside outlets)

And the problem is not resolved and now I am paranoid that I have a leak like the one I just got fixed. Plus it's fixin' to rain here for two days....

Talk about when it rains it pours!

I called the pastor of the church I have been attending down here and he called a couple of folks. One handyman guy gets back tomorrow morning, the other a electrician has not responded yet

Hopefully, someone will get back and it won't cost me an arm and a leg because I only have an arm right now. Had to put new batteries in my diesel....(Cut to "Nobody knows the Trouble I've Seen....)



Green light is
Quote:
Originally Posted by apackoftwo View Post
No, its the GFI in the kitchen and when I reset it the front outlet came on, then went out about 6-7 times but now has quit working entirely

There is a GFI in the bathroom but that one is ok

And the only outlet not working is in the front, the kitchen, bathroom and the outside ones are all working.

There has also been moisture here, from the freezing at night and warming during the day and now rain the past two days, so since they are designed to shut off because of moisture..Could be a combination of both things, to many items plugged in combined with moisture and it died. Or it was just its time.

So when it dries out a bit here I will check for moisture in the outside plug, refrigerator plug etc before I install the new GFI and then I will report back!

About my diesel, I thought I had to plug it in when it got freezing. Probably because I stored it in my garage in the Winter and would plug it in when it was freezing for long periods of time. Just thought I was supposed to. However, I will plug into the camp post before I use it. Although this cold snap is supposed to break here Tues. No more freezing temps at night! Night time temps after Tues. 40-50's this week.

Thank You! It's all a learning experience!
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