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Old 10-17-2015, 08:08 PM   #21
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Here is a quick look at the damage caused by the water leak on the right front of the my 2475. More demo required before repairs can ensue.

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Old 10-17-2015, 08:22 PM   #22
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While trying to replace the side wall bottom plate I discovered a patch under the carpet at the entry door. No doubt at some time it looked the Sunline had some rain damage by leaving the door open. Pretty shoddy work!! I guess the repair didn't warrant a few more inches cut back to catch the entire damaged area. Some folks just do enough to get by. It amazes me sometimes....

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Old 10-17-2015, 08:32 PM   #23
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Last update for today. I had a pretty good day and decided to pull the "patch" in front of the door and this is what I found. Man what some folks call work. It a shame to see this kind of "repair" I checked the fender well and it seems to be sealed. I'm going to give it a real close look at a later date. I've got to get her closed to the weather. This evening after I shot this video I actually cut an 18" section down the entire hallway and expanded the cut to 32" in the very front of the Sunline. I am going to replace the wall bottom plate and also the floor sill plate with new material. I'm using nothing but treated lumber and 10 year guarantee deck screws. Progress is moving forward slowly but surely. Tomorrow I actually get to install some material instead of just removing old rotted stuff. I'll have an update tomorrow.

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Old 10-19-2015, 09:33 PM   #24
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I was able to actually put some new wood in the Sunline today. The reconstruction has begun finally!!! I had some questions for you guys that have guided me so far. I hope they are clear... It sure feels nice to be able to put something together instead of just demoing more and more stuff. I don't know if this is typical of age but it seems like allot of damage was just from lack of maintenance. Anyways I think I have turned the corner and am beginning to reassemble stuff. My only concern is will I have to do the same thing to the other side of the camper. I can see why folks trade their older campers in. Have a look and let me know what you think.

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Old 10-20-2015, 05:10 AM   #25
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Hi Phil, you're doing very good work there! First, I have a question-is that a 61 or 62 Falcon I see in the back? A future project?

5/8" OSB or 3/4" marine grade plywood. I can think of one reason to go with the OSB-the uniform floor height. It may not make much of a difference other than that, the extra weight might not be too much, I don't really know. I think when any manufacturer is planning materials and methods for an RV, every little bit of weight savings adds up to a lot at the end of the plan, so your adding some here and there probably won't be much of a concern. Marine grade is probably overkill since the wood will probably not see any dampness while you own it. I know myself, ever since my restoration project, I've been on heightened alert concerning any water intrusion at all. I also know the feeling you have about going the extra mile as long as you have it all apart and are starting over. For myself, keeping perspective is difficult when I'm immersed in a project. Asking questions as you are doing is good.

The wall stiffness. When you apply your wall paneling, you will most probably need to but them together. When I did mine, I installed 1/4" luan (not 1/8" as the factory did) and used a filler at the butt joints. Then, I applied commercial grade (54" wide) wallpaper over them, disregarding the joints in the luan. Wall stiffness would be a good thing in this case, since I would not have wanted any butt joints to show through the wallpaper. I never did see anything like that years later. Bottom line, I think stiffer is better.

Keep up the good work and keep the video updates coming.
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Old 10-28-2015, 06:43 PM   #26
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Hi Phil,

I second your great progress. Your videos are GREAT!!!! they will help many other Sunliners in the future. Keep them and the pic's coming.

The floor, OSB or marine grade plywood. In this case of a TT, going to all the expense on the marine grade while a hands down solid solution may not yield the highest payback verses putting the same funds into the roof structure seams. I'll expand on that in a moment.

Weight, yes weight adds up and your not done yet. You have upgraded the roof with sheathing verses the thick corrugate board. That was a choice, you gave up some cargo capacity but you gained a walk on roof and an order of magnitude better roof structure. But this upgrade came with lost cargo capacity on the axles/tires but it could be well worth it for you, (me too for that matter). From my point of view for me, I would not upgrade the floor to the marine grade, I would buy the best weather rated OSB and like you said, add a few extra 2 x 3 where it makes sense. I would be after keeping the cargo capacity but yet maximizing the floor as best it can within the constraints.

If there is water entry into the system, that is the killer. Yes the treated wood would help ward off the rot of those parts but not everything in the structure can handle the water. From what I have learned, you have to keep the water out and the rest is tolerable.

Consider this when you are doing your new roof. http://www.sunlineclub.com/forums/f7...ics-11610.html

There is an industry issue in the way the roof joins the side walls. What is used does work, but it is not without pit falls and even if the owner does roof checks and caulking adjustments on those 4 times a year, a caulk separation can still happen in joint ares after several years of age of the caulking. I found that in about 3 to 4 years, the splits start showing up more frequent. And one spring after a winter of snow, I has a split way bigger then I wanted and I know it was not there in the fall. I gave up on using the caulk as the primary defense upon water entry. I use it as a secondary. The link shows the Eternabond primary seal now. Yes, it cost me some money, but I want to keep this camper a long time and not have it rot in the process.

The next area is the rain gutter system. In my opinion it falls way short of a long lasting design. It is too small for the water flow and too short to not have water sitting on top of the steel plated screws. Water fills up in the gutter due to small size with a few twigs or leaves in it and then the gutter fills solid with water. Water gets behind the vinyl strip used to cover the screw heads and water and carbon steel screws eats away at the screw heads. This is not just a Sunline issue, almost all campers are made this way with rubber roofs. Some very high end 5er's wrap the rubber over a curved roof to wall transition to help the problem but they still use the same too small RV gutter rail.

I addressed this with my better final solution. Countersink the screw holes in the gutter rail, used stainless screws and extend the Eternabond wrap to the bottom of the gutter. This creates the best I could come up with still using the too small RV gutter. One side of the camper I did not use the flat head, just covered over the hex head screws. While it did work OK, the flat head works better.

I did spread the gutter open a small amount where it seemed squeezed in. It is still undersized but better then what I started with.

I would save the funds on the marine grade and put that money into the eternabond.

This is only my opinion, just given out to help spur thoughts for you. You may even take this to the next level and make it even better.

Your doing great and will have a very solid camper when your done.

Thanks

John
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Old 10-28-2015, 06:51 PM   #27
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I forgot to comment on the wall wiggle. Yes, they all wiggle with the factory construction. Most all other brands wiggle too. The way they are made, they will wiggle. The wiggle is less once you put the inside wall board on and the siding. And the wall becomes stiffer when a cabinet is inside at that locations. The inside cabinets and inside walls create the stiffness in the camper.

Now to which is better, a stiff wall or a wiggly wall? I do not have years of RV building experience to back this up, however your structure using wood still flexes even if the joint is tighter. The campers that use aluminum studs, while some are less wiggly, they still flex.

You do need some ability to flex. Just I do not think what you have created is too stiff. The entire camper frame is going to flex and the wall will follow it. Remember, the entire wall structure is supported by 2 x 4's laying flat.

I think your doing good and would continue that way.

Hope this helps

John
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Old 11-11-2015, 09:17 PM   #28
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Wow!! Is been almost a month since I updated anything. The work has slowed down quite a bit as the weather is changing and rain is more or less the order of the day. I have made some pretty good progress though. The framing is complete and the camper is much stiffer than when I began. I did have to open the top of the opposite wall to replace some bad wood. Everything is drilled glued and screwed. I highly recommend Titebond III as its water proof once dried. The other thing I can highly recommend is these lag type bolts. man they are impressive!!

I did shoot a video so here it is. I really appreciate all the advice and tips given by John and Rich. You guy's experience is much appreciated. Its raining again as I'm uploading this....
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File Type: jpg lag_bolts.jpg (98.1 KB, 13 views)
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Old 11-12-2015, 04:28 AM   #29
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Phil, that is an excellent job you're doing and all of your work is much better than the factory. It looks more like cabinetry than a trailer frame. And the factory never used glue, just staples. So you've got a very sound structure to build on now.
How do you plan on attaching the cabinets since you will be enclosing the outer skin first? Sunline built them from the inside out you know.
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Old 11-12-2015, 08:30 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vcrt View Post
Phil, that is an excellent job you're doing and all of your work is much better than the factory. It looks more like cabinetry than a trailer frame. And the factory never used glue, just staples. So you've got a very sound structure to build on now.
How do you plan on attaching the cabinets since you will be enclosing the outer skin first? Sunline built them from the inside out you know.
Rich
Thanks for the kind words. It's coming along pretty well. The attachment of cabinets is pretty easy. Once the wife let's me know what and where she wants them I'll put some stringers up before the wall sheeting goes on. About 1-1/2 inches of the tee brace will hang down from the ceiling. I plan on putting an overhead cabinet in across that front wall something like the original. That 2x3 will be behind the top of the cabinet and covering it up. The rest depends on what she comes up with.
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Old 11-14-2015, 05:19 PM   #31
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Hi Phil,

Yes, I second this! Very nice work!

Those new type of lag screws.... Yes I have bought some too. A different brand though. I was using them to hold 2x4' stakes to 2x12 framing. Theses where 3/8 lags and used my 1/2 drill to screw them in. That larger head and the very sharp thread with the self starting point, they bite in well and the large head holds. They are not coming out....

It is said that a proper glued joint will be stronger then the wood itself. And you test showed that too. Doing cabinetry and making a "goof" as you learn, when the joint is glued right and clamped until dried, the wood is splitting apart before the joint breaks. And on maple that is tuff...

The front frame of the camper looks great. I like the radius blended top angle parts. Take more time, but the effect comes out very well.

I happened to see the round tail light on the Falcon. That brings back memories. My first car was a 65 Falcon and those round tail lights. I paid $200 for it... It was used naturally. The straight inline 6 engine if I recall right. Ran well.

Keep up the good work

John
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Old 11-15-2015, 05:21 PM   #32
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While we're on the subject of Falcons (a little digression here) Barbara drove a 62 Country Squire wagon (woodgrain side trim, roof rack) that was fabulous. We lived in NYC at the time and during the coldest winters, when other car were having trouble starting, she had no problems (in line six also). I later found an old ad that boasted that these cars were built to start in very cold weather.
Anyway, we picked it up cheap just before our oldest daughter was born in 1981, so it was pretty old then, but she will tell you, even though it had some body rot, it always ran great and gave no problems, one of the best cars she ever owned!
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Old 03-06-2016, 06:13 AM   #33
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Been a long time, no posts from Phil. Waiting for spring to get back to this?
Can't wait to see some more updates.
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Old 09-03-2016, 09:51 PM   #34
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Hey Guys. Its been awhile and Its great to be back at it. The video explains whats been going on. Here's an update.
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Old 09-05-2016, 06:04 AM   #35
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So, life got in the way once again. Totally understandable. I think our best attitude is one of loose planning, because we don't call the shots basically, we react to them.
The work you've done looks great Phil and with your patience, it's coming along nicely. Hopefully, you'll be "camping with the eagles" in November!
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Old 09-06-2016, 08:01 AM   #36
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Great work! It came out really good.

Keep up the good work and thanks for sharing

John
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Old 09-06-2016, 03:18 PM   #37
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Thanks for the kinds words John and Rich. It is a labor of love I guess.... Anyways, I was going to get the roof on for Labor day but guess what; we got 15 minutes of drizzle on Sunday night at about 10 PM. Needless to say it was enough to wet the roof pretty good. I was a bit upset to say the least. So Labor day was spent drying the roof. With the sun around here it doesn't take long.
So anyway, I took a day off of work today, to get the roof on. After all the prep work and everything, I decided to take a temp reading on the roof of the camper. In the video I said it was 124*F but I misread it and it was 128. So I'm going to let it cool off a bit and start in a couple of hours with the final application. Here is the final look before roof install.
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Old 09-08-2016, 07:31 PM   #38
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Roof's on!! Finally got to glue down the roof. I had about six feet left after the install. I guess I could have ordered the twenty foot instead of the twenty five foot length. I had some assistance from my youngest. He's pretty enthused about going camping. Its been a long time coming but we are making progress. I only used a single Gallon of glue though. I thought I was putting it on pretty thick as I could move it around pretty easy for about 20 minutes. next is the side trims and the end treatments. Hopefully I'll have her closed in this weekend.

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Old 09-09-2016, 03:26 AM   #39
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Nice to see it coming back together again!
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Old 09-11-2016, 08:06 PM   #40
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Hi Phil,

I agree, good thing you waited until the wood and day cooled down. 124 or 128F is a lot to add a potential negative variable into the mix.

As to how much glue, here is from Dicro instructions my son and I used on his camper roof.

Quote:
3. Open the waterbased adhesive (901-BA) and stir thoroughly. Using a 9” wide short nap paint roller, apply adhesive to the substrate at a rate of 160 sq. ft. per gallon. The membrane is to be mated with the adhesive as quickly as possible.
From here http://www.dicorproducts.com/catalog.../#installation

So a gallon of glue should do 8 ft x 20 ft = 160. I can say that, that ratio is needed as if you do a lot less, the wood can absorb some and then you do not get good contact. This water based glue for sure has to touch the rubber well enough to create the bond. I would not go mega overboard but better to have a little more I would say is better then less then required.

Your doing great!! Keep up the good work.

Thanks for sharing

John
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