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Old 06-10-2017, 10:22 PM   #1
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rewcamper is an unknown quantity at this point
pre purchase thoughts

any help in finding the leak source in a 2003 2370? moisture meter shows 100% from the bottom of the front window down, over to the cabinets and wall,and high , on some of the floor underneath. I assume it may be the window..in the back under kitchen cabinets, and in the floor from the rear door over to the bathroom. but no wall moisture. rear roof corner soft, and around the fridge vent. I can pull it all apart and fix all . but I just wanted to find the source. i have repaired other campers , but never actually found the source, when fixed.i understand water goes everywhere, but it would be nice to know that I found the leak, not just found the wet.the camper is nice no smells no bad interior panels, needs stuff fixed $2500 trying for $2000 from a dealer...next stop, junked if I don't intervene. thanks
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Old 06-12-2017, 04:45 AM   #2
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You may never find where it was coming from, but since you will have to open up so much of the roof, windows, doors etc, re-sealing them correctly will ensure that no water gets in again and as long as you remove (or effectively treat) the damaged parts, you will have a good camper.
From your description, it sounds like if you decide to buy this one, you will be doing a lot of work. Not a whole lot of money in materials, but a lot of time.

Wishing you well with your choice,
Rich
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Old 06-13-2017, 07:50 AM   #3
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Hi rewcamper,

Here are some of my thoughts. If you have pics you can post so we can see the areas, this greatly helps greatly to go along with the words. Consider this a "generic" what it might be reply.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rewcamper View Post
any help in finding the leak source in a 2003 2370? moisture meter shows 100% from the bottom of the front window down, over to the cabinets and wall,and high , on some of the floor underneath. I assume it may be the window..

in the back under kitchen cabinets, and in the floor from the rear door over to the bathroom. but no wall moisture.

rear roof corner soft, and around the fridge vent.
You have several different areas there. Some may be related to the same infection or you have several infections.

Lets take the easier one first.
Quote:
moisture meter shows 100% from the bottom of the front window down, over to the cabinets and wall,and high, on some of the floor underneath.
Odds are favorable this is a window seal leak. Part of it or maybe all of it aligns with a meter reading of 100% under the window you reported. The putty tape has dried out, shrunk, cracked and allowed water to leak in. Towing in the rain is hard on this front window with putty tape as the only seal. However you used the words, "over to the cabinets and high" and then "some of the floor underneath."

Explain what you mean on "over to the cabinets and wall and high"? We are handicapped with no pics trying to help you figure this out. Looking at the floor plan, this is a front bedroom camper. A window water leak large enough can spread horizontally towards the bed side cabinets and go down into the floor. But the up high comment I cannot figure out where you mean, you found high meter readings in the bed side cabinets above the window? Explain some more.

See this post link for more on one way the front window can leak as I have it on the left and right of the front window. Just in may case I caught it early in the life of the leaf and it has not spread across the whole wall or down into the front floor thankfully.




http://www.sunlineclub.com/forums/f7...tml#post137483

Next area this one
Quote:
in the back under kitchen cabinets, and in the floor from the rear door over to the bathroom. but no wall moisture.
The no wall moisture comment, do you mean this is all floor moisture across the full width of the camper and no readings above 0% went up the wall starting at the bottom of the floor heading up the wall? Not even 6" worth?

How far out from the back wall heading towards the front of the camper is the floor wet? (how many feet/inches) And is this 100% wet, 40% or 20%?

Need more info before I guesstimate what it might be as there are a few ways to do that.

Now to the third area
Quote:
rear roof corner soft, and around the fridge vent.
Which rear roof corner is soft? the corner over the shower or the corner over the range near the entry door?

The around the fridge vent, do you mean the fridge vent on the roof or the fridge vent on the side of the camper?

And is the "rear roof corner soft" and "around the fridge vent" 2 different areas or all part of one area?

Sorry for the many questions, these words can be interrupted many different ways with no pics.

Glad to help speculate more to give you a place to start the hunt for the leak source but need some more details on each area and try to list the areas and not run them all together if possible so we know where one area stops and the next starts. Since we can only read the words, we can only pick out the description posted. We understand on a camper you do not own yet getting pics is hard.

Identifying where leaks start and stop is not an easy process sometimes. Even when you open the wall up looking you can accidentally wipe away evidence on how it got in. This is like "camper leak CSI"....

But... the good news, you have a moisture meter. If you can learn all you can with that meter before opening up the camper and narrow this down to a few possible ways the leak started, it really helps raise your confidence you found the one or multiple leaks sources.

And in the end, like VCRT stated, sometimes you really do not know beyond the shadow of a doubt the leak source and you end up rebuilding the entire area and by using the better sealing methods with better materials this greatly helps stop a reinfection from starting.

Hope this helps

John
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Old 06-13-2017, 03:25 PM   #4
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SUN #9416
rewcamper is an unknown quantity at this point
thughts on purchase

john thanks again for your involment. sorry I wasn't specific...if I can remember. rear floor under cabinets damp spots back to rear wall and about 2 feet out from rear wall, and across to the bath wall where the door is 80 % to 12% as you come forward.wall behind lower cabinets low moisture a few %, and nothing as you go up the wall. I'm thinking rear door, or roof corner above and running down vertical corner to floor. outermost floor gone right through to plastic. upper fridge vent on roof soft on street side and back end. other roof corner over shower..rubber band feel. I think rafter end and or rear wood at roof seam.moisture reading just out to about 10 inches from corner roof seam. front wall I meant under window, inside tall cabinet to about even with the front window bottom, and down to floor, and street side floor corner. no rot visible inside, on walls, and all paneling solid. I think this is newer, but I'm dreading whats going on inside. we're having hot humid weather and it won't be long till it's worse. I think I'm passing on this one..$2500, and I really just wanted to go somewhere this year, after fixing the other mechanical systems. it's not that I couldn't do it, but this would be my second finished but unused trailer in less than a year.i'm 67 and can't retire ever (carpenter), so I wanted something to use. I've done boats, motorcycles,antique canoes, and a bunch of vw bugs, so I really guess I don't want months of surprises. I own nothing now and would probably prefer a 15 to 17 footer that needed major work, without me wanting to use it. also is the paneling glued to the wall framing ? one more thing to destroy if theres no rot to release it...guess i'll watch the ads. thankyou for all the feed back I just hope I didn't waste your time. haha I paid it one last visit at the dealers today.....BOB
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Old 06-14-2017, 05:24 AM   #5
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I think that was a wise decision rewcamper, since you want to get some use out of a camper this year, you'd be rushing to get through it. Talk about stress!

I see many Sunlines going for $3500-6500.00 on Craigslist and of course I don't know their condition, but at $2500.00, you don't have a lot of room for the time and effort you'd be investing on the camper you just described.

I believe the interior panels are glued as well as nailed to the studs.

Also, I wanted to make a comment about the panels. Since they are covered on the inside with waterproof vinyl, moisture from behind will not appear to be a problem until the luan they are made from is pretty well saturated. At that point, the vinyl will become wavy indicating that the water has been doing it's dirty work for some time, affecting anything else that's behind it as well. This is why an owner will think the trailer is "dry".
Then, when the vinyl becomes uneven, they think Oh, there must be a small leak somewhere.
Rich
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Old 06-14-2017, 06:29 AM   #6
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SUN #9416
rewcamper is an unknown quantity at this point
purchse

thanks rich, sadly, but not regrettably, I think I've made my decision...nothing worse than the feeling that you HAVE to get to something to finish it. a trailer is a fairly large item in the yard, and you're constantly reminded it should be done . maybe for now i'll just out fit my van ( which I have already made beds for) throw my stuff in and head for Sebago lake !!! (maine)..while I continue my search...hmmmm what if the dealership called and said "hey bob ole buddy, would you like it for free ?"
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Old 06-14-2017, 08:18 AM   #7
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Free might work! But I wouldn't hold my breath.
Rich
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Old 06-14-2017, 06:01 PM   #8
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Hi Bob,

It looks like you beat the decision up pretty good and as of your last note.... you are going to pass on this one. BUT, look what you have learned from this camper and your new moisture meter tool.

I'll add some thoughts next to your areas so you know for next time what "might" be the issue. First is, we need to see the floor plan to make the words fit better.

2003 T2370


Quote:
Originally Posted by rewcamper View Post
rear floor under cabinets damp spots back to rear wall and about 2 feet out from rear wall, and across to the bath wall where the door is 80 % to 12% as you come forward.wall behind lower cabinets low moisture a few %, and nothing as you go up the wall. I'm thinking rear door, or roof corner above and running down vertical corner to floor. outermost floor gone right through to plastic.
H'mm... roof corner leaks generally leave some kind of tracks behind of higher up moisture. Did you put the meter on the ceiling along the back wall? If not, remember that next time. A corner leak many times leaves wet up in the attic. I agree a door leak, (door not sealed right) can do this. There is also the possibility of a fresh water piping leak. If the prior owner had a cracked fitting on the HW heater or something, mopped up the water but the leak went into the floor structure and they never cleaned it up, this creates a wet floor.

What is odd is the dry wall. A roof leak large enough to get the floor rotted generally leaves a trail of rot down some wall on the way to under the floor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rewcamper View Post
upper fridge vent on roof soft on street side and back end.

other roof corner over shower..rubber band feel. I think rafter end and or rear wood at roof seam.moisture reading just out to about 10 inches from corner roof seam.
The shower roof area rubber band feeling. That means the bud board on the roof is totally separated from the rubber in that area. It takes a qty of water generally to create this. That water had to flow down OR it was small enough that it did not flow down but is up in the ceiling still or went into dry rot. The water evaporated enough or flowed way enough but the fungus is still there are dry rot it doing it's thing creating a dust pile up there. Both the fridge vent and the shower corner may have infected the rear floor.

It may also be that the water intrusion location become better over time. Meaning they use to store the camper nose high and all the water ran to the back of the roof and in. Then it was stored it nose low. Now while the rear had a hole, the water is not beating in so fast and some may actually evaporate out up in the ceiling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rewcamper View Post
front wall I meant under window, inside tall cabinet to about even with the front window bottom, and down to floor, and street side floor corner. no rot visible inside, on walls, and all paneling solid.

also is the paneling glued to the wall framing ? one more thing to destroy if theres no rot to release it...guess i'll watch the ads. thankyou for all the feed back I just hope I didn't waste your time. haha I paid it one last visit at the dealers today.....BOB
The front windows have been known for leaks. It is a putty tape issue. And if it was towed in the rain, it is even worse with a front window leak.

The outside walls where pre-made in wood shop at the factory and yes, the wall panel is glued to the studs and small staples in some places. Also pending the layout, they leave inside double walls open on one side as the camper is being built. This allows them to add screws to mount the wall wood structure to the floor etc on the open side. Then they add a last panel inside and staple it on. They may be glue on this too. I ran into this on my 2004 T1950 on an interior wall and cabinet. They are counting on the outside wall glue to create a stiffer camper.

If all the wall board is still feeling solid and not water stained that you can see, then the rot may not have totally consumed on the wall board. This is much easier to fix if the 1/8" luan is not totally gone. If it is partly gone you take the side off, let it dry out and then use a resin called Rot Dr and coat the rotted wall. It may take a few coats. This resin hardens up the wood and kills any dry rot fungus. This way you do not have to deal with the wall board, just fix the camper from the outside.

No waste of my time, no worries there. You learned a lot on this one so that is a good thing. We too learn from this even though you decided to not get it. This makes it worth it.

Hope you find one you like in the upcoming months.

John
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Old 06-14-2017, 06:27 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vcrt View Post
Also, I wanted to make a comment about the panels. Since they are covered on the inside with waterproof vinyl, moisture from behind will not appear to be a problem until the luan they are made from is pretty well saturated. At that point, the vinyl will become wavy indicating that the water has been doing it's dirty work for some time, affecting anything else that's behind it as well. This is why an owner will think the trailer is "dry".
Then, when the vinyl becomes uneven, they think Oh, there must be a small leak somewhere.
Rich
What Rich stated is 100% dead on accurate from what I have found. I'll add one more thing. On the newer campers Sunline use a vinyl round bead strip on every ceiling, wall and floor joint. This vinyl round bead covers up the joint crack. It looks better. As the camper flexes, that joint opens and closes a little and the fit up does not have to be dead perfect as the round bead covers it up.

That round bead strip acts like a water plug. They have it stapled about event 2 to 3 inches to the wall, floor ceiling etc and it makes a good water stop. It plugs up that crack.

So the water flows by gravity to the easiest path it can to go "down". Coming through the vinyl wall paper or through that round bead is the hard way. Once the 1/8" luan is very advanced in rot or the wood behind the bead trim rots, then the water stains start showing up inside. This is what I have found.

I really do not know what model year Sunline started using the round vinyl crack bead. The older 80's campers may not have it.

This is what this bead trim is called. Sunline used the hollow bead on mine and in the tan color.

"hollow bead welt RV trailer trim"
bead welt RV trailer trim | eBay

Thanks

John
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Old 06-14-2017, 07:09 PM   #10
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Good evening,

I have that type of bead or similar in a dark brown in my 1987. I am not sure if it is hollow but it looks a lot like what is displayed from your link.


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Old 06-14-2017, 08:23 PM   #11
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Hi Tommie,

Thanks for posting., Now we know this welt bead goes all the way back to 1987. Sunline was using it a long time. The higher end campers use this. It takes more time to put all that welt bead on and there is a cost with the materials too.

Here is a pic of what is in my 2004 T1950. Look at the floor line. Same bead trim all over.


Thanks

John
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