T2499 Rubber Ryde suspension with lift kit ?

[kanyonkitty]

Hey Pat,

OK, I'm posting a few pics of my 2499 so you can see how the trailer body sits in relationship to the wheels, and also pics of the axle/wheels.

The axle setup on mine looks basically the same as yours to me, so what else is different to raise yours so much?

It looks like the bottom of my goldish/tan trim is just about in line with the top of the center cap of the wheel, and Pats' trailer sits way higher.







Sorry don't know how to get Pats axle pic in here with mine.

Kitty

[partimcmpr]

Looks like his axle and your axles are in different positions. Your axle hangs down and lines up with the wheel at the 6 oclock position. His is at 3 oclock position. (I cannot come up with a better way to describe it.)

If you look at his axle, it is even with the center of the wheel. Your axle is below the center of the wheel. The difference lies in what is between the axle and the wheel itself, but I cannot tell what that is.

Obviously, I am now out of my league, but thought I would point out a difference I noticed.

[kanyonkitty]

David,

I saw what you were referring to. I wonder "IF" my axle just needs to be rotated some. Might have to contact Alko Kober to see if that is an OK thing to do. But if it can be done, that should raise the trailer I would think.

Thanks

[partimcmpr]

One issue to consider is what impact it will have on the ride. Maybe some of those who have lifted their trailers can chime in. On the Dexter page they actually emphasize that lifting the trailer can change the ride of the trailer. Of course, you will probably also need to adjust your hitch as well.

I also read that in most cases, the axle is not actually flipped, but lifted. I am still not an expert, but we learn something new each day.

Later,
David

[Mooney]

An axle "flip", in a leaf spring setup, really does not "flip" the axle, it is a slang-ish term for:

"Let's weld up (or use the Dexter kit) some new spring seats on TOP of the axle, (or below the axle for a drop effect if the axle is already below the springs) and relocate the axle under (or over) the spring, which nets you a gain (or loss) of the sum of the axle tub diameter, plus the spring seat, plus the spring pack itself to the stock height of a given object"

So, if your spring and spring seat = 1.5", and your axle = 2.5", swap where the axle sits, and you get a 4" rise or drop.

As for Sunny vs. Emam- it appears that their (Pat and Cindy's) axle was rotated and relocated (to keep the wheels in the right spot); giving them a boost (as David stated before).

The leaf spring axle relocation is a common practice in 4wd vehicles for an inexpensive lift. It's a pretty easy thing to do if you have time, a welder, and access to basic hand tools (but air tools are always better). I have been in on this modification in a Suzuki Samurai, and it was pretty straightforward- but I don't have the desire to spend a weekend day dealing with it (with only hand tools in a driveway), and I would need to buy extra jack stands, etc.

As to the ride of the trailer, obviously you will have a higher center of gravity, and should adjust your driving (TURNS) accordingly, but since the components are all the same (and there are no driveline components as in a vehicle) the "ride" should not change.

I am bringing tools to adjust my hitch platform as necessary, I would guess that I will have to raise the platform 3.5 to 4 inches in total to remain level.

*PHEW* I didn't know I could type all that....or that I knew so much about it....

I just have to hope that I remember to measure the ground height before I go- it's supposed to be an icy/ snowy morning on Friday- I need to get rolling before traffic does in Providence, RI so I don't have to deal with the morons in the snow while pulling...

[JohnB]

Kitty and Pat

I “think” I figured out the difference. Had to do some digging to find all these posts of yours with pics but here goes.

First Kitty’s pic. NOTE: Her rubber ride axle arm is pointing up towards the 2:00 positions from the inside looking towards the wheel. The center of her wheel is about at the bottom of TT frame.




Now to Emans. Pat’s wheel center is about right on the axle center or 2: lower. His rubber axles arm is horizontal where Kitty’s is pointing up hill to the 2:00 position.







Here is Kitty’s side view


Emans side view. You can see the lift


Now how is this done??

Here is what I “think” they did.

See here on the Kober site. Kober rubber ride



They insert the axle arm in a different location. According to Kober the Starting angle can be +25 degrees, 0 degrees (like Pats) and – 20 degrees (like Kitty’s)

What I have not figured out is how to pull the axle arm out to replace the rubber cords. “If” this can be done, then you “may” be able to insert it offset at a different starting angle and gain lift. May have to make a phone call to Kober to find out if this can be done.

Hope this helps.

John

[kanyonkitty]

WOW John,

Thanks for the great information. I just might contact Alko-Kober, maybe even send them a link to that message and see what they say.

I personally like the way Sunny looks, but I like the clearance that Pat has. That additional clearance would eliminate me having to make the extra turn around in my yard to get Sunny up the driveway into his RV Port without dragging.

[emam]

Hey John, thanks for explaining that to us. I too was at a loss for how they did it.

Once I saw Kitty's I was a bit confused myself. I could see the differance the axles were at, but didnt know why. I honestly thought that the reason mine was lifted was because of that square piece of steel stokc between the frame and the axles, but then when I saw Kitty's I was at a loss.

I'll bet that all you ahve to do, it pull the axle out and slide it back in at a different angle which would set the soft ride arm at a higher location.

I've never pulled one at a lower setting, but I can tell you that we've pulled ours over 25,000 miles this past year, and have stopped clearing off the table while traveling.

I even leave the laptop up there and havent had it move on us once. I've pulled a bunch of trailers with leaf springs in my time, and know that they tend to bounce around quite a bit. Not so with the soft ride axles.

Kitty, I'd give the manufacturer a call, and I'll bet it'll be an easy fix. One thing that you have to watch is the first step is a bit of a thigh buster with it lifted. I need a nice step like Hutchs or Johns

Pat

[kanyonkitty]

OK< here is a little more info that I have obtained about the difference in ride height between Pats' 2499 and mine. The Alko-Kober rubber Torsion Suspension can as John B stated be set for +25 degrees, 0 degrees or -20 degrees on the trailing arm. Depending which starting angle degree is selected at the time the AXLE is MADE determines how high your rig will sit once the axle is installed. This is NOT CHANGABLE once the axle is made & installed. In order to change the angle degree of the trailing arm, I would have to put new axles under my Sunny. NOT going to do that, can't afford it. Guess, I'll just have to watch the high grades


Now, on a different note, my left front wheel bearing once again appears to be pretty much greaseless The other three wheels, when I pry off the little black rubber plug all have a good amount of grease showing on everything that I can see, even the castle nut is pretty greased up. This is not the case wth the left front, the castle nut is clean. So now, I gotta find some help getting this taken care of. This is the side that I had the bearing burn up on while I was in Kansas, and is supposed to have all new parts.

[Mooney]

Kitty,

Have them check the brake adjustment and tightness of everything too... perhaps something is dragging and heating up the whole area of the hub.

Good luck!

Greg

[kanyonkitty]

OK Guys, I'm back on the axle/trailer lift thought again

I was wondering since I have the Alko-Kober axles, "IF" it would be possible to put a spacer (about 2") between the "L" shaped piece and the square piece that appear to be bolted together

I know 2 inches is not a lot of lift, but it sure would help me in my driveway.

I need your wisdom on this thought.

Kitty

sorry, don't know how to insert an arrow to point to area I'm talking about.

[GhettoMedic]

Originally Posted by kanyonkitty

OK Guys, I'm back on the axle/trailer lift thought again

I was wondering since I have the Alko-Kober axles, "IF" it would be possible to put a spacer (about 2") between the "L" shaped piece and the square piece that appear to be bolted together

I know 2 inches is not a lot of lift, but it sure would help me in my driveway.

I need your wisdom on this thought.

Kitty

sorry, don't know how to insert an arrow to point to area I'm talking about.

Is this what you mean Kitty?

[kanyonkitty]

Yes, thank you, thank you That is exactly what I don't know how to do. I was windering "IF" it would be possible to insert about 2 inches of lift where you have so kindly inserted the arrow. Any thoughts on possible ill effects? Looks like the bolts could be removed, spacer installed and longer bolts to re-attach everything.

Kitty

[JohnB]

Kitty

Sorry I have not made it to your post. Been out of town for work a lot lately and still…. and it has affected my Sunline Club habit big time.

From what I can see, yes a spacer properly installed/made would work. That spacer would need to be rigid enough to take the weight and it should be pinned or welded in place, so the axle cannot shift forward or backwards to mess up the tire tracking. I would add a full-length spacer block per say not small pieces and make that spacer again pinned or welded to the original frame. Going real long bolts thru several loose pieces may be something to avoid.

If you are connected with a weld shop they can fix you up or even if you have a bus mechanic help out. Most of those guys/gals are very creative. My uncle use to own/run a bus garage and busses take a lot of use/work to upkeep.

Good luck and let us know how you make out if you do this.

John

PS on Edit: The long bolts are not a problem to go thru the original holes, thru the spacer and then thru the axle. The problem on the spacer I see is to not have the spacer just sandwiched in the middle and not rigid to the frame. If the spacer is only held in place by friction and the spacer shifts slightly, then your tire tracking will be off, and in this case long bolts thru clearance holes of 3 pieces can affect you. By welding or pinning the spacer in place, it is like extending the frame down, the spacer is rigid and then the bolts hold the axle rigid even when bumpy roads come your way. If you cannot figure out what I'm saying, ask away.

[Mooney]

Being in WV, you should have a plethora of four wheel drive shops within a relatively reasonable distance.

Those guys (and gals) would probably be able to do that without much trouble or too much cost. Weld in a couple pieces of HD steel, and good to go.

[kanyonkitty]

Just the dizzy blonde again Well, after a phone call to Axle, Inc in Elkhart, IN. I can either replace my axles ($260 each plus shipping) or put spacers in. Think I'll take Sunny to the bus garage and see what a mechanic can do for me, or check with my son, he has a friend that's building big utility/car trailers. I want about a 2 or 3 inch lift max, as I need to still be able to get under my RV Port.

See ya all in 9 or 10 days,

Kitty

[JohnB]

Go Kitty Go......

We know you can do it.

Gee $260 for both axles???? or is that only 1?

The spacer will work as good as the new axle and take a lot less work. The axle I'm sure is just the tube, the arms and spindle. All the brakes, wiring etc has to be moved as well. At least I would think for that price.

Good luck

John

[emam]

I might be totally clueless on this, but sitting and looking at the axles, why couldnt the whole axle just be flipped upside down or turned 180 degrees which would make that arm face up rather than down?

Wouldnt that create a lift? Please, John B or someone who understands this stuff explain this to me better...LOL

[JohnB]

Pat

Your idea is conceivable, but has a few issues to overcome.

See Kitty’s pic


If you just take the axle off and flip it completely over so the pivoting arm which was tilted up is now tilted down and is still pointing to the rear of the TT, this will lift the camper, but these 3 things have to be worked out.

1.The mounting flange would be on the bottom verse the top. Can be over come if needed by attaching a new flange.

2. When you flip it, it may lift 6” plus inches. Ground clearance will not be a problem, but I do not know if this high is really wanted. Higher center of gravity, more wind drag, might hit Kitty's car port. But she will gain ground clearance!

3. The brakes, there are left side and right side made as the wheel is moving forward for the main direction of higher speed braking. The brakes do work in reverse but not as natural as good forward. This could be overcome by taking the left and rights and switching them too. See here. Look at the brake lever arm. It pivots back verses pushed forward when the magnet is energized



I have never done this but these 3 things at least come to mind to think thru on how to overcome them. Adding the spacer blocks might be easier.

John

[emam]

Thanks for the detailed explaination John, I knew you'd pull through with your wisdom